Thailand new change - world wide income at Thai tax levels to be taxed

[wellington]

If hold multiple directorships in different regions, to minimize tax outlay, invest any profits/salary in investment accounts, form a Thai company and pay taxes locally as a workaround?

I.e. have no foreign income visible

This won’t work because they will look at your lifestyle and living standards

 

[jafo]

This won’t work because they will look at your lifestyle and living standards

What if someone has, e.g., €20M in a savings account in Monaco?
Would they have to pay local Thai income taxes when they remit to Thailand for their living expenses?

 

[wellington]

What if someone has, e.g., €20M in a savings account in Monaco?
Would they have to pay local Thai income taxes when they remit to Thailand for their living expenses?

CRS would share that with Thailand.

CRS would share that with Thailand.

Reality is as it stands and in the future if you have savings pre 2024 and remit its tax free and that applies post their next change (world wide taxation)

I’ve remarked a few times

For those that have savings there is really no change

The impacts of the changes are focused towards people earning money opposed to those living off the principle or savings of prior earned money

Basically Thailand isn’t the place for those that wish to operate a offshore company but live off the income

Of living off prior investments principle or savings pre 2024 nothing changes

I.e for me nothing changes until they decide to force a offshore company onshore because the major shareholder is inactive lives onshore voiding the offshore management and operations etc

But even then that can be managed by the fact the company doesn’t run day to day revenues wise

So structured liquidation

Those also impacted are citizens of countries where they have to be taxed somewhere or taxed at home instead

 

[FZSAAS]

This won’t work because they will look at your lifestyle and living standards

It will if I limit my income and invest what i would have taken as salary via my businesses with a view to realising the investments on leaving Thailand.

 

[toums]

CRS would share that with Thailand.

If you didnt give the Thai address (and/or TIN) at the MC Bank,how they can share CRS to TH ?

 

[jafo]

If you didnt give the Thai address (and/or TIN) at the MC Bank,how they can share CRS to TH ?

I think @wellington means that I would have to give this to the Thai, and they might request it from MC.

My question was a litmus test (for me). No single bank, person, or "government" knows where all my funds are or how much money I have. Anyone who complies with this BS is living in LalaLand!


PS. The f*cking ex-president of Honduras was just sentenced to 45 years in prison in the US. Imagine if that guy has access to information showing you had €1 billion! Yesterday, you would have had a home invasion robbery!
BTW, home invasion robberies are prevalent, but they aren't reported much in the media. When I was fighting my case in the BOP, almost 5% of the inmates were in there due to very violent and sometimes deadly home invasion robberies.
The f*cking ex-president of Argentina, Mauricio Macri, was kidnapped by the Argentinian FEDERAL POLICE, and his family had to pay a ransom for him not to be murdered (40 years ago).
Due to the CRS bullsh1t, several relatives of prominent businessmen are being held for ransom in Latin America regularly, but NOBODY reports on this BS!

 

[wellington]

I think @wellington means that I would have to give this to the Thai, and they might request it from MC.

My question was a litmus test (for me). No single bank, person, or "government" knows where all my funds are or how much money I have. Anyone who complies with this BS is living in LalaLand!


PS. The f*cking ex-president of Honduras was just sentenced to 45 years in prison in the US. Imagine if that guy has access to information showing you had €1 billion! Yesterday, you would have had a home invasion robbery!
BTW, home invasion robberies are prevalent, but they aren't reported much in the media. When I was fighting my case in the BOP, almost 5% of the inmates were in there due to very violent and sometimes deadly home invasion robberies.
The f*cking ex-president of Argentina, Mauricio Macri, was kidnapped by the Argentinian FEDERAL POLICE, and his family had to pay a ransom for him not to be murdered (40 years ago).
Due to the CRS bullsh1t, several relatives of prominent businessmen are being held for ransom in Latin America regularly, but NOBODY reports on this BS!

None of us like CRS hence bearer assets are the future

But reference accounts the process as I understand it

No TIN = send to citizenship country = name DOB match = forward to residence reported country

 

[Mercury]

What if someone has, e.g., €20M in a savings account in Monaco?
Would they have to pay local Thai income taxes when they remit to Thailand for their living expenses?

As per current rules,

If non tax resident in Thailand Then

Any remittance is always tax-free​

Else

If remittance is money earned before 01/01/2024 Then​

Tax-free​

Else​

Remittances are taxables unless (fully or partly) tax exempted with supporting docs according to countries DTA, Gift/Inheritance rules... or not reached the first tax threshold (allowances/deductions apply)​

End If​

End If

 

[wellington]

Gift/Inheritance rules... or not reached the first tax threshold

IF GIFT and funds are sourced as Remittance = Tax as Income (as per law).

Gifts only tax free if ALREADY in country.

 

[JackAlabama]

As per current rules,

If non tax resident in Thailand Then

Any remittance is always tax-free​

Else

If remittance is money earned before 01/01/2024 Then​

Tax-free​

Else​

Remittances are taxables unless (fully or partly) tax exempted with supporting docs according to countries DTA, Gift/Inheritance rules... or not reached the first tax threshold (allowances/deductions apply)​

End If​

End If

Pretty good stuff, id add tax free for all income earned before becoming a tax resident in the first place.
If you move to Thailand in 2028, its all income up to 31.12.2027.

 

[Mercury]

IF GIFT and funds are sourced as Remittance = Tax as Income (as per law).

Gifts only tax free if ALREADY in country.

There's a debate about that as it's not clearly stated in Thai Gift Law and it's way of interpretation.

I want to believe gifts are tax-free (up to the THB10/20M threshold per year) for the receiver and the sender wherever it comes from, until the gift rules are officially clarified or there's a case law that proves otherwise.

 

[wellington]

There's a debate about that as it's not clearly stated in Thai Gift Law and it's way of interpretation.

I want to believe gifts are tax-free (up to the THB10/20M threshold per year) for the receiver and the sender wherever it comes from, until the gift rules are officially clarified or there's a case law that proves otherwise.

No, no debate, first hand discussion with revenue department.

Within Thailand you can gift to family (etc) up-to-20m THB per person each year tax free (have to document it and submit in annual tax return over a certain threshold 250k)

If the funds/assets are within Thailand its tax free.

If the funds/assets are outside of Thailand, you have two tax points (source country gifting laws, i.e UK/EU is 0% for a specific amount and then % wise from there), and then you have income tax within Thailand for the receiver based in remittance laws IF NOT Savings prior 2024).

In addition the funds/assets can't then be transferred back to you, and or used for your benefit in any capacity.

That is the law as it is currently, working around that is tax evasion and money laundering, not just in Thailand but overseas in source country, as well as likely the US if doing a international wire using the SWIFT system routed through SDNY.

 

[jafo]

As per current rules,

If non tax resident in Thailand Then

Any remittance is always tax-free​

Else

If remittance is money earned before 01/01/2024 Then​

Tax-free​

Else​

Remittances are taxables unless (fully or partly) tax exempted with supporting docs according to countries DTA, Gift/Inheritance rules... or not reached the first tax threshold (allowances/deductions apply)​

End If​

End If

I love me a Visual Basic!

 

[Mercury]

If the funds/assets are outside of Thailand, you have two tax points (source country gifting laws, i.e UK/EU is 0% for a specific amount and then % wise from there), and then you have income tax within Thailand for the receiver based in remittance laws IF NOT Savings prior 2024).

In addition the funds/assets can't then be transferred back to you, and or used for your benefit in any capacity.

That is the law as it is currently, working around that is tax evasion and money laundering, not just in Thailand but overseas in source country, as well as likely the US if doing a international wire using the SWIFT system routed through SDNY.

Well, we then agree, maybe I was unclear: The receiver is solely liable for the gift tax if the gift exceeds the yearly threshold (THB10/20M). The sender is not liable in Thailand wherever he sends the money from. The remittance occurs for the receiver not the sender as the same remittance event can't be happening for both the sender and the receiver in the same time.

I'm not discussing gift tax from source country as it's irrelevant to Thailand.

 

[FZSAAS]

Pretty good stuff, id add tax free for all income earned before becoming a tax resident in the first place.
If you move to Thailand in 2028, its all income up to 31.12.2027.

What if you move in 2024, become an employee (eor), so will have a Thai tax return done by the employer, but you won't be in the country for >180 days in 2024?

 

[unth72]

One other area people need to consider is domicile based taxation

I.e if a citizen of say the Uk which doesn’t consider you tax resident when non resident x years and no connections to the Uk, but floating around (non 180+ days in any country) - but having a home in say Thailand etc for Thailand may consider you tax domiciled within it even if floating around - this likely impacts Europeans more for non residents etc

So I've been out of the UK for about 15 years now, visited once for a week around 12 years ago - haven't been back since all done and dusted with them.

This year I'm spending less than 180 days inside Thailand - more like 175, will probably do this for the next few years as well so I won't be tax resident.

Had a capital gain of a bit under $1.5 million so far, was planning on using the remit next year thing but that ended and the cap gain was this year so it's not savings! Not this year anyway.

The capital gain was in the US, Crypto sale and I'm not a US passport holder or green card holder, etc - zero connections with the US except for this Bitcoin account.

I was under the impression that simply staying out of Thailand and in Cambodia for less than 183 days, with perhaps a holiday for a couple of weeks in Vietnam I will be 'full nomad' this year. Zero gains are realised in Thailand, Cambodia or Vietnam in 2024.

Will Thailand want to look at this 2024 cap gain or ignore it due to not being tax resident.

I'm currently renting two places - one in Thailand and one in Phnom Penh, will stay in a resort hotel for m Vietnam holiday.

You seem very knowledgeable thanks for any inside you can provide. I think I'm over thinking this but to me this is a large sum of money.

 

[Mercury]

What if you move in 2024, become an employee (eor), so will have a Thai tax return done by the employer, but you won't be in the country for >180 days in 2024?

If you are non tax resident (stay < 180 days/year) you are only taxed on your local income in Thailand.

 

[wellington]

So I've been out of the UK for about 15 years now, visited once for a week around 12 years ago - haven't been back since all done and dusted with them.

This year I'm spending less than 180 days inside Thailand - more like 175, will probably do this for the next few years as well so I won't be tax resident.

Had a capital gain of a bit under $1.5 million so far, was planning on using the remit next year thing but that ended and the cap gain was this year so it's not savings! Not this year anyway.

The capital gain was in the US, Crypto sale and I'm not a US passport holder or green card holder, etc - zero connections with the US except for this Bitcoin account.

I was under the impression that simply staying out of Thailand and in Cambodia for less than 183 days, with perhaps a holiday for a couple of weeks in Vietnam I will be 'full nomad' this year. Zero gains are realised in Thailand, Cambodia or Vietnam in 2024.

Will Thailand want to look at this 2024 cap gain or ignore it due to not being tax resident.

I'm currently renting two places - one in Thailand and one in Phnom Penh, will stay in a resort hotel for m Vietnam holiday.

You seem very knowledgeable thanks for any inside you can provide. I think I'm over thinking this but to me this is a large sum of money.

If Brit life much easier as you won’t have to worry about other locations for tax

Just ensure you have a accountant look through the paperwork to make sure you owe nothing in the UK (attachments, transactions)

Ref Thailand likewise if the home isn’t in your name directly and no kids - check default Domicile arguments

Otherwise good to go

If crypto related expect funds to be frozen a few times though with explanations

Just ensure you have a accountant look through the paperwork to make sure you owe nothing in the UK (attachments, transactions)

Also one bit of advice I can give

Don’t hold sterling ever going forward as allows a in for HMRC to at least try and squeeze you as all sterling is situ in the UK and it’s all about UK income generation arguments.

I wouldn’t advise holding $ but as a proxy SGD the % moves are up/down but relative.

Don’t hold it in Baht unless using as they are intent on debasing as their costs explode and their working pop declines

Kasikorn can offer a SGD account but all transactions are done in the regional bank in person - so bangkok or Phuket etc

Obviously don’t hold in Euros as they will have to debase (already are) or even go back to negative (you pay them)

If you are non tax resident (stay < 180 days/year) you are only taxed on your local income in Thailand.

That depends on domicile argument - Thailand in theory can argue because he’s lived 15 yrs in Thailand they have jurisdiction for tax affairs

Hasn’t happened yet to my knowledge but they can back step for 5 yrs

 

[cryptofriendly]

So I've been out of the UK for about 15 years now, visited once for a week around 12 years ago - haven't been back since all done and dusted with them.

This year I'm spending less than 180 days inside Thailand - more like 175, will probably do this for the next few years as well so I won't be tax resident.

Had a capital gain of a bit under $1.5 million so far, was planning on using the remit next year thing but that ended and the cap gain was this year so it's not savings! Not this year anyway.

The capital gain was in the US, Crypto sale and I'm not a US passport holder or green card holder, etc - zero connections with the US except for this Bitcoin account.

I was under the impression that simply staying out of Thailand and in Cambodia for less than 183 days, with perhaps a holiday for a couple of weeks in Vietnam I will be 'full nomad' this year. Zero gains are realised in Thailand, Cambodia or Vietnam in 2024.

Will Thailand want to look at this 2024 cap gain or ignore it due to not being tax resident.

I'm currently renting two places - one in Thailand and one in Phnom Penh, will stay in a resort hotel for m Vietnam holiday.

You seem very knowledgeable thanks for any inside you can provide. I think I'm over thinking this but to me this is a large sum of money.

I believe that if you stay less than 180 days per calendar year in TH, KH, INDO, LAO or VN, and are technically a tourist without income, you don't need to worry much. You could just open a local bank account in one of the other coutries, receive your fiat from crypto there, and bring a bit less than 20K (USD) in cash when crossing the border to TH.

Of course, that's just for small amounts, for bigger amounts there are other out-of-the-box solutions (white hat even), which I want to stay, so no details on those..

 

[FZSAAS]

If you are non tax resident (stay < 180 days/year) you are only taxed on your local income in Thailand.

So if non tax resident with local tax only in 2024, but full tax resident in 2025, maxmize salary in other regions to savings in 2024 before becoming a full tax resident with global reporting responsibilities in 2025?