Thailand new change - world wide income at Thai tax levels to be taxed

[yomboloz]

Just heard from a friend about a Thai friend we have, his account was frozen for tax evasion.

Apparently sold a couple of boat(s) and transactions were over a certain threshold, didn't declare and they froze the account(s).

I am calling B/S as i know for a fact when you transfer a yacht in Thailand you pay tax there and then at the boat log office (can't remember the name).

So i suspect it was undeclared income taxe(s) from working on boats (repairs) for foreigners -> which if you map out will mean services payments in Thailand will come under scrutiny also.

Will give more information when i know more, but apparently two transfers over 1.8m THB which is false as its all transfers over 250k that get scrutinised, and an account that has over 3000 transfers in a year in any account under your name.

Weren't the tranfsers for purchasing a boat/yacht a lot more than 1.8M THB? Something more like 10M+?

 

[wellington]

Weren't the tranfsers for purchasing a boat/yacht a lot more than 1.8M THB? Something more like 10M+?

I'm going on what was informed to me, It can't be caused by buying a boat/yacht as the transactions for purchase have tax deducted at point of sale.

So i believe there's a bit of lying going on.

What it could be is work un-reported and un-taxed, this would in theory make sense.

It could also be commissions for yacht sales he was involved in the middle off, and un-taxed, un-reported.

What i do know is that it shows that those involved in services industries (yachting as an example) are being observed.

 

[yomboloz]

I'm going on what was informed to me, It can't be caused by buying a boat/yacht as the transactions for purchase have tax deducted at point of sale.

So i believe there's a bit of lying going on.

What it could be is work un-reported and un-taxed, this would in theory make sense.

It could also be commissions for yacht sales he was involved in the middle off, and un-taxed, un-reported.

What i do know is that it shows that those involved in services industries (yachting as an example) are being observed.

Yeah that would make sense. By the way could I PM you?

 

[JackAlabama]

I'm going on what was informed to me, It can't be caused by buying a boat/yacht as the transactions for purchase have tax deducted at point of sale.

So i believe there's a bit of lying going on.

What it could be is work un-reported and un-taxed, this would in theory make sense.

It could also be commissions for yacht sales he was involved in the middle off, and un-taxed, un-reported.

What i do know is that it shows that those involved in services industries (yachting as an example) are being observed.

Well, overall makes sense to me bc its like 100x easier to locally police compared to sophisticated international setups. Just looking at the average foreign language skill (barely existent even regarding English).

I have been told smth similar by a chick I sometimes meet for tea whose friend ran one of these small lazada-like/run on the side shops. Apparently some alert went off at the bank and she had to pay tax on these sales including a penalty thereafter, no biggie after all just like 15k thb or smth but nevertheless smth went off.
But always hard to say with stories from a friend of a friend, but that one could have easily triggered the banking transaction count threshold which made an alarm go off.

 

[wellington]

Well, overall makes sense to me bc its like 100x easier to locally police compared to sophisticated international setups. Just looking at the average foreign language skill (barely existent even regarding English).

I have been told smth similar by a chick I sometimes meet for tea whose friend ran one of these small lazada-like/run on the side shops. Apparently some alert went off at the bank and she had to pay tax on these sales including a penalty thereafter, no biggie after all just like 15k thb or smth but nevertheless smth went off.
But always hard to say with stories from a friend of a friend, but that one could have easily triggered the banking transaction count threshold which made an alarm go off.

My wife pays taxes for funds she shouldn't (gift from me to her for household costs) her argument is that its better to pay than have to deal with revenue department, haven dealt with them ref a company i agree....

The value(s) i put above are the warning siren levels.

Yeah that would make sense. By the way could I PM you?

Sure i think i have messages (never checked)

 

[Mercury]

My wife pays taxes for funds she shouldn't (gift from me to her for household costs) her argument is that its better to pay than have to deal with revenue department

If she pays she's already dealing with them.

In the improbable case your wife gets audited how will she justify this gift income? If she replies "it's a gift from my husband" then that could raise digging questions from TRD wondering why paying tax on legally exempted income...

If you mean she declares your gift as her own business income that's called money laundering.

 

[JackAlabama]

If you mean she declares your gift as her own business income that's called money laundering.

no its not. Because for ml, money has to come from known criminal activity.

If she pays she's already dealing with them.

In the improbable case your wife gets audited how will she justify this gift income? If she replies "it's a gift from my husband" then that could raise digging questions from TRD wondering why paying tax on legally exempted income...

what would they ask if every incoming bank transfer is declared as income? They should issue a refund then, and thats why they will never ask.

 

[jafo]

If you mean she declares your gift as her own business income that's called money laundering.

This is PLAIN wrong, and I wrote about it here: Re-introduce crypto gains to brick and mortar fiat bank

To make matters easier, I asked ChatGPT to make it easier for the layman. Even Chatgpt has issues with reality, but I had a great teacher. May he RIP!
Here we go....
(1)

(2)

We are getting somewhere, but since I pounced on TWO Supreme Court justices over this and they realized the errors of their way...we take it one step further with chatgpt which is UNEMOTIONAL and has ZERO EGO.... something humans can't and won't do...

(3)

#Bingooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We have a WINNER!

PS. There is NO way cops, regular lawyers, or tax agents have enough brain cells to comprehend this...let alone the willingness to cut off their "money supply."

PSS. If you want further reading on this, this is the case:

Source: United States v. Santos, 553 U.S. 507 (2008)

And here are the sophistry, casuistry, and the mental gymnastics the clowns in the legal world are using to stay relevant:

no its not. Because for ml, money has to come from known criminal activity.

You are smart AF! Did you have any legal training? Or did you study this book or under this judge?

Because it is EXTREMELY rare for even trained and seasoned lawyers to figure this out (in my experience...of course, I could be surrounded by idiots, and since I am one, I don't notice the others )

Here is the answer I wrote: Thailand new change - world wide income at Thai tax levels to be taxed

Cheers!

 

[wellington]

If she pays she's already dealing with them.

In the improbable case your wife gets audited how will she justify this gift income? If she replies "it's a gift from my husband" then that could raise digging questions from TRD wondering why paying tax on legally exempted income...

If you mean she declares your gift as her own business income that's called money laundering.

No, its personal, pays the cost of the staff etc household costs.

She declares it because its better to declare and pay than sit there and argue with the Revenue department -> i've just gone through 3/4 yrs of that.

My funds come from dividends paid every 5-10 yrs, as these are (were) tax free in Thailand, but bringing funds in is now taxable a gift from me to her is technically tax free, but as its income to me (overseas) its remitted as a payment thus gray area for tax as its technically income, but also a gift, in addition its old income thus savings.

Better to pay tax on it (we've done so for 5+ yrs) than have to deal with the revenue department, with all her deductions its not much and really not worth arguing about.


----



Not sure where the post went from paying taxes to money laundering lol...

Or what Thailand has to do with US Statutes on Money Laundering.

In the improbable case your wife gets audited how will she justify this gift income? If she replies "it's a gift from my husband" then that could raise digging questions from TRD wondering why paying tax on legally exempted income...

Revenue already been dealing with the company side for 3/4 yrs.

As for 'reason' = simple answer, old income that is gifted to cover the cost of the overheads of the household.

Unsure whether tax is owed, paid tax anyway.

Obviously aware no tax owed but better to pay tax than have to deal with the revenue department, i think its only 300-500k THB a year

 

[jafo]

Or what Thailand has to do with US Statutes on Money Laundering.

I just gave an example, as most (if not all) jurisdictions follow the US lead on this due to US dollars and international transfers. Same with Europe.

But you are 100% correct! It's NOT money laundering AT ALL!
We all know what money laundering is (or some of us know), and it's the proceeds of a crime! Your gift is straight legal money gifted to your wife. Whether she conceals it or not has NO bearing. Of course, she is very smart and knows the obduration of her own people (I'm assuming she is Asian) and doesn't want to lose opportunity cost arguing with a low-IQ public servant hellbent on robbing the fruits of her labor.

As my US sparring partner says, "Outside the squared circle, you win EVERY fight you avoid!"

 

[wellington]

f she pays she's already dealing with them.

No it's a simple online form every year - calculates taxes post deductions and she pays via QR

If you mean she declares your gift as her own business income that's called money laundering.

Just seen this part of your response.

No, it's from my savings to my wife (offshore to onshore).

She pays tax, simple as that, one way to look at it is 'gift' another way to look at it is 'income'.

With the new remittance tax that creates another 'grey area'.

To be on the safe side, she pays tax on it.

Simple as that, person (husband) to person (wife) but offshore to onshore.

As we (she predominately) have considerable assets (family came over and bought chunks of land after coming down from China generations ago) - thus hers (inheritance) + ours (-+xxm) in Thailand we'd rather not f**k around and find out, so pay taxes for funds that are remitted to cover the cost of the household(s) overheads.

I realise a lot of the discussions on here have been on avoiding tax in Thailand, i've always been clear I have interest in avoiding tax from dividends in Thailand (as per the law) but when it comes to remittance tax (if i owe i will pay and if its a large amount i will spend time overseas) - i also outlined in great detail how to legally avoid remitting utilising overseas companies opposed to domestic from insurances through to other costs.

If you have family or connections, or assets its sometimes the price you pay for peace, i.e i pay 0.5% of my net worth to Switzerland annually and haven't visited in 5 yrs and am not a citizen, why, property, i could debate and argue net-worth and so on but for peace of mind i just pay.

All the time Thailand doesn't enforce overseas tax in Thailand (for dividends when i get paid next) i am content.

 

[Mercury]

no its not. Because for ml, money has to come from known criminal activity.

OK, I will rephrase: money could be view as ML until his wife can explain legal funds provenance.

No, it's from my savings to my wife (offshore to onshore).

She pays tax, simple as that, one way to look at it is 'gift' another way to look at it is 'income'.

With the new remittance tax that creates another 'grey area'.

To be on the safe side, she pays tax on it.

Your wife declares as personal income what is actually a gift (5% tax is triggered from THB20M/year and beyond).

I'm not sure it will avoid more questioning to reply to TRD: "This income is actually a gift from my husband but I prefer to declare it as personal income and pay tax to be on the safe side".
Safe side of what/who?

If full tax is anyway paid on this gift remittance why not wiring directly to yourself?

 

[wellington]

OK, I will rephrase: money could be view as ML until his wife can explain legal funds provenance.


Your wife declares as personal income what is actually a gift (5% tax is triggered from THB20M/year and beyond).

I'm not sure it will avoid more questioning to reply to TRD: "This income is actually a gift from my husband but I prefer to declare it as personal income and pay tax to be on the safe side".
Safe side of what/who?

If full tax is anyway paid on this gift remittance why not wiring directly to yourself?

We don't avoid any questions, we avoid any claims of tax avoidance/evasion.

Revenue department we contact annually, hence i was the most clued up on the changes in Thailand.

---

Not sure where M/L is coming from (not sure why you are implying).

If full tax is anyway paid on this gift remittance why not wiring directly to yourself?

I keep very little in fiat liquid.

our wife declares as personal income what is actually a gift (5% tax is triggered from THB20M/year and beyond).

No, (simpleton) i pay my wife, you know what many people do (gift their wife money).

And 20m is ONLY TAX FREE ONSHORE NOW. Not OFFSHORE to ONSHORE. UNLESS SAVINGS and the process for that is x account overseas to x account onshore, then transfer onshore.

You will also note throughout my posts I’ve always stated the same thing - my wife is a firm believer in paying tax on funds because it’s less hassle than dealing with in the event you are accused of tax evasion - I’ve often pointed out to people they should pay their tax in Thailand instead of trying to find loop holes to evade or avoid it because the Thai revenue department do not f**k around, I’ve also gone into great detail the dealings I’ve had with them commercially and the experience of such.

Ergo do not f**k around and find out because finding out ain’t pretty

 

[jafo]

As we (she predominately) have considerable assets (family came over and bought chunks of land after coming down from China generations ago) - thus hers (inheritance) + ours (-+20m $) in Thailand we'd rather not f**k around and find out, so pay taxes for funds that are remitted to cover the cost of the household(s) overheads.

Your wife is smart AF! If I were in her situation and had generational wealth, I would have done EXACTLY the same thing!

For me, the reality is that I am the first person in our family or relatives who has earned any money. My family is literally poor as sh1t. Mostly farmers or blue-collar workers! Hence, why I was able to set up in Monaco in the 90s when NOBODY was asking ANY questions! And compliance officers did NOT even exist back then...or at least I had never heard of them.

 

[Mercury]

And 20m is ONLY TAX FREE ONSHORE NOW. Not OFFSHORE to ONSHORE. UNLESS SAVINGS and the process for that is x account overseas to x account onshore, then transfer onshore.

There is no clear statement from RD on that. My view is gifting is tax-free, for both the giftee and the gifter, wherever it comes from.

 

[wellington]

Your wife is smart AF! If I were in her situation and had generational wealth, I would have done EXACTLY the same thing!

For me, the reality is that I am the first person in our family or relatives who has earned any money. My family is literally poor as sh1t. Mostly farmers or blue-collar workers! Hence, why I was able to set up in Monaco in the 90s when NOBODY was asking ANY questions! And compliance officers did NOT even exist back then...or at least I had never heard of them.

Only 4% of the population in Thailand pay taxes.

She Studied in Switzerland and then worked for corporate (Central Group) as a future leader (future Director)

When she had kids she left the working we had a hike in living costs, As i don't work, and don't have a income in Thailand, it has to be remitted from dividends savings (every 5-10yrs i am paid), speaking with my accountant (HLB Int) and lawyers with the funds allocated earning yield the best approach was not remittance based but a gift or a income - she opted as a income (declared her end) and with all the deductions its not something we worry about.

With the new rules that came in the cost of Three children etc, we moved to reduce costs (thus taxes) by offsetting local costs with international providers, and the staff paying tax (previously not one of them seemed to declare it even though we declared it).

Now its simpler her end, simpler h/h staff end, and less stressful my end.

But as mentioned a few times, in her words, best to pay something than have trouble.

And as i mentioned a day or so ago 'trouble is freezing of assets/funds' as the boat repairman just found out after f*****g around.

There is no clear statement from RD on that. My view is gifting is tax-free, for both the giftee and the gifter, wherever it comes from.

I had 1-1 conversations.

Remitted funds as gift from non Thai to Thai from offshore to onshore is remittance tax charged.

*unless its savings then the appropriate method is offshore your account to onshore your account, onshore your account to onshore your wife.

I advise you to not launder funds after tax evading if you haven't factored that in, and hire a tax advisor and speaking to the revenue department.

 

[JackAlabama]

This is PLAIN wrong, and I wrote about it here: Re-introduce crypto gains to brick and mortar fiat bank

To make matters easier, I asked ChatGPT to make it easier for the layman. Even Chatgpt has issues with reality, but I had a great teacher. May he RIP!
Here we go....
(1)
View attachment 7346

(2)
View attachment 7348

We are getting somewhere, but since I pounced on TWO Supreme Court justices over this and they realized the errors of their way...we take it one step further with chatgpt which is UNEMOTIONAL and has ZERO EGO.... something humans can't and won't do...

(3)
View attachment 7349

#Bingooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We have a WINNER!

PS. There is NO way cops, regular lawyers, or tax agents have enough brain cells to comprehend this...let alone the willingness to cut off their "money supply."

PSS. If you want further reading on this, this is the case:
View attachment 7350

Source: United States v. Santos, 553 U.S. 507 (2008)

And here are the sophistry, casuistry, and the mental gymnastics the clowns in the legal world are using to stay relevant:
View attachment 7351



You are smart AF! Did you have any legal training? Or did you study this book or under this judge?

Yes I had some training. Straight in the devils kitchen before becoming a full time degen and part time troll.

View attachment 7352

Because it is EXTREMELY rare for even trained and seasoned lawyers to figure this out (in my experience...of course, I could be surrounded by idiots, and since I am one, I don't notice the others )

Here is the answer I wrote: Thailand new change - world wide income at Thai tax levels to be taxed

Cheers!

good book.

Your wife is smart AF! If I were in her situation and had generational wealth, I would have done EXACTLY the same thing!

For me, the reality is that I am the first person in our family or relatives who has earned any money. My family is literally poor as sh1t. Mostly farmers or blue-collar workers! Hence, why I was able to set up in Monaco in the 90s when NOBODY was asking ANY questions! And compliance officers did NOT even exist back then...or at least I had never heard of them.

exactly. Its the way to do it. Different circumstances, different gameplans for everyone.

20M usd is a good chunk in a country where your average somchai makes like 400 usd a month and 100k usd promised today as pension is considered good.
Id assume being watched quite carefully.

 

[yomboloz]

No it's a simple online form every year - calculates taxes post deductions and she pays via QR


Just seen this part of your response.

No, it's from my savings to my wife (offshore to onshore).

She pays tax, simple as that, one way to look at it is 'gift' another way to look at it is 'income'.

With the new remittance tax that creates another 'grey area'.

To be on the safe side, she pays tax on it.

Simple as that, person (husband) to person (wife) but offshore to onshore.

As we (she predominately) have considerable assets (family came over and bought chunks of land after coming down from China generations ago) - thus hers (inheritance) + ours (-+xxm) in Thailand we'd rather not f**k around and find out, so pay taxes for funds that are remitted to cover the cost of the household(s) overheads.

I realise a lot of the discussions on here have been on avoiding tax in Thailand, i've always been clear I have interest in avoiding tax from dividends in Thailand (as per the law) but when it comes to remittance tax (if i owe i will pay and if its a large amount i will spend time overseas) - i also outlined in great detail how to legally avoid remitting utilising overseas companies opposed to domestic from insurances through to other costs.

If you have family or connections, or assets its sometimes the price you pay for peace, i.e i pay 0.5% of my net worth to Switzerland annually and haven't visited in 5 yrs and am not a citizen, why, property, i could debate and argue net-worth and so on but for peace of mind i just pay.

All the time Thailand doesn't enforce overseas tax in Thailand (for dividends when i get paid next) i am content.

From my understanding you do have a lot of Thai Assets (house etc?), and you would overall fit the Global Wealthy Citizen LTR criteria, why not just get the LTR visa and remmit funds tax free?

Do you think it will change in the future, where the priviledge of tax exemption on remmited funds will be removed?

I couldn't find the button to DM you for some reason, I think only you can initiate a conversation.

 

[wellington]

From my understanding you do have a lot of Thai Assets (house etc?), and you would overall fit the Global Wealthy Citizen LTR criteria, why not just get the LTR visa and remmit funds tax free?

Do you think it will change in the future, where the priviledge of tax exemption on remmited funds will be removed?

I couldn't find the button to DM you for some reason, I think only you can initiate a conversation.

I used to have a investor visa - went to elite - not sure what next - looking at Singapore for the kids education

Thailand has structural issues (demographics) -> see Japan

They have to either debase or tax, the wealth of the }*}{ will be debased so they don’t want to do that as he has a lot of cash tied up as cash in the country (unsafe to park in most places due to looming war)

Having said that the 10k wallet is both populism focused as well as liquidating the markets by debasing the currency.

So they appear to be following a hybrid model

Population will collapse over next 40yrs and Thailand will have asset crashes like Japan outside of hot zones

 

[yomboloz]

I used to have a investor visa - went to elite - not sure what next - looking at Singapore for the kids education

Thailand has structural issues (demographics) -> see Japan

They have to either debase or tax, the wealth of the King will be debased so they don’t want to do that as he has a lot of cash tied up as cash in the country (unsafe to park in most places due to looming war)

I'm currently on Elite and have a year and a half left, but thinking about finally pulling the trigger on buying property here and getting the LTR visa would potentially save me a lot of money on taxes over the next 10 years.

I definitively see the appeal of SG for kid's education, I'd probably consider something similar when I have kids over the age of 7-8 or so.