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Relocate to Monaco, how money required?
- Thread starter diro
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I am stealing this! I forgot all about this. Growing up Catholic (Portuguese and Italian) and Protestant (because of Dutch and German neighbors
)...it's been a long time, but this verse from the Bible is SO good! 
Bruuhhhhhh.... you have missed ALL the signals!
You've run EVERY red light! 
And you clearly have no idea of what you're talking about and never been a resident of Monaco. Getting back your "Monaco rEsIdEnce" is as easy as going back and reapplying.
At this time in my life, Monaco is not for me. I'd rather pay 25-35% tax in my home country and be a normal person, not an individual obsessed with not paying taxes, governments and "tax men".
Being able to socialize, see your friends, family, and most importantly.... living in a highly productive society (nobody in Monaco except the locals seem to work - in medium to low value added activities, mind you...) far outweighs the childish obsession of living in a place you don't like so you can not pay taxes and be able to "live your life" (May I ask, does your government knock on your door every day?) or satisfy your borderline schizophrenic obsession with tax authorities.
If I regret paying taxes and talking to "tax men" (I suppose you mean like my CPA... right?) ... I simply move back, as easy as that.
Go fly a kite.
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The wealthy elite do not live wherever, they structure their lives around preserving and building their wealth. They do not spend their time in one place, for it is boring and not conducive to the previously mentioned reasons. The fact you choose to stay in one play and pay your fare share is a choice you've made. Everyone in Monaco has money working for them, so you're right they don't work in the traditional wage slave or small business owner sense. Can you elaborate why you no longer feel Monaco is not for you and you prefer some other presumably Eastern European country?
Educate me dear sir,
, the setup being described here with no tax residency anywhere only works until it doesn't. Some financial institution will eventually ask for proof of tax compliance in your place of tax residency. If not for any reason other than further due diligence, compliance, etc. It is not a sound setup IMO. It does however work and is cheap and "effective".
Educate me dear sir,
, the setup being described here with no tax residency anywhere only works until it doesn't. Some financial institution will eventually ask for proof of tax compliance in your place of tax residency. If not for any reason other than further due diligence, compliance, etc. It is not a sound setup IMO. It does however work and is cheap and "effective".
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LMAO some of you are pathetic. Just because someone is able to move to your dreamed Monaco and not like it doesn't mean you have to be jealous.
I'm not from Eastern Europe. I don't like the place, it's too ugly for me. And I'm not a wealthy elite (I doubt you are too) I'm just a small business owner. Didn't fit.
Educate me dear sir,
Who said I'm a "digitial nomad" dear sir? I'm going back where I'm happy and paying whatever I have to pay. Luckily I can afford it, can you though?
Dear sir is a common internet jargon usually on Discord and Telegram. The OP was using low-IQ words like "bruh", to fit in I was too speaking colloquially. That post wasn't directed towards you and yes I can afford it. I am not a digital nomad, I don't work for someone, I have passive income. You're easily triggered and agitated, you made a choice you seem to be content with, good for you. Monaco is a great place to spend time for many reasons, network, lifestyle, close proximity to some of the most beautiful places on earth, but to each is there own.
25% might be acceptable if you get something in return, in particular freedom.
Monaco has 0% taxes, 0% freedom and 50% infrastructure.
My priority is freedom, low taxes are a bonus, if infrastructures are absent I will build them (you just need space for that), make locals happy and entertain myself in the process.
How does Monaco lack freedom? Infrastructure in Monaco is great, mind you Monaco is 1/2 the size of NYC's Central Park. The roads, hospitals, tunnels, port, internet and every other aspect of civilian infrastructure is A+.
Surveillance, police, informers, the patron…
That’s why I wrote 50%. Is there any warehouse, an airport, or some free land where to build?
Surveillance is a necessity and is encouraged by the residents, not to mention it is everywhere nowadays, the phone and computer you're using to write this post is surveilling you, not even going to mention the meta data being collected from every single piece of networking equipment on the internet between you and all the web servers, CDNs, and more by 5 eyes countries.
The Police in Monaco don't bother anyone unless you're acting out, mostly driving recklessly. It is nice to see that concentration of police, thieves are caught immediately, there is zero street crime. Monaco is what it is; a place for the wealthy to spend a few months, some live full-time, but the majority do not. The real estate is of very high quality, the events too, and the restaurants and beach clubs are also very good, the close proximaty to the French rivera and Italy are also a major plus. Outside of that it is not obviously comparable in lifestyle to a large city such as London, Paris, NYC, Milan. But for what it is, it is very unique. You cannot replicate Monaco in any LATM, Caribbean, or SEA country.
The Police in Monaco don't bother anyone unless you're acting out, mostly driving recklessly. It is nice to see that concentration of police, thieves are caught immediately, there is zero street crime. Monaco is what it is; a place for the wealthy to spend a few months, some live full-time, but the majority do not. The real estate is of very high quality, the events too, and the restaurants and beach clubs are also very good, the close proximaty to the French rivera and Italy are also a major plus. Outside of that it is not obviously comparable in lifestyle to a large city such as London, Paris, NYC, Milan. But for what it is, it is very unique. You cannot replicate Monaco in any LATM, Caribbean, or SEA country.
Have you ever lived in Monaco? I'm 100% sure most people defending Monaco on this forum have never lived there, save for a few. It's NOT a nice place. It's ugly, noisy, 0 infrastructure, lackluster services, loads of shady people. Can't deny I met some lovely people, most are regular Monegasque citizens, but the rich immigrant people are insufferable for the most part.
Oh and the French Riviera is widely overrated, it's literally a dump full of debauchery and zero productivity. Not a single worthwhile tech or consumer company has come out of that region. It's a waiter & escort economy... with dirty streets that smell like piss, and plagued of Gucci hat-wearing pension-payers. Cmon.
(1) Gentlemen, let's respect everyone's right to live where they like and where they feel loved.
Luckily, we ALL have different tastes.
(2) @saintjohnny has a wonderful family and friends that he loves and loves him back, and he prefers a place where there is a soul devoid of pretentious people. (Can't blame him for this - I already mentioned I tried this with my mom, but she refused). The wealth (family & friends) @saintjohnny has is actually MUCH BETTER than money or financial wealth!
I do NOT have this type of "wealth"! My ONLY loved person, my mom, has passed away (recently) as a centenarian!
(3) @JohnnyDoe has incredible stratospheric social intelligence (in addition to the regular IQ intelligence). He can wade through locals/natives like nothing! I once heard a very wealthy Spaniard refer to this talent as "El don de torear a los pendejos." (Roughly translated in English = "The gift of bullfighting idiots."
The intelligence required to pull this off is comparable to Leonardo da Vinci's or Michelangelo's! It's f*cking rare AF!
I can NOT do this! I am NOT that smart!
If you do NOT understand this, may I, ONCE AGAIN, veer you towards reading this book from Carlo M. Cipolla:
(A) Allegro ma non troppo con Le leggi fondamentali della stupidità umana. (Italian version)
(B) The Basic Laws of Human Stupidity! (English version)
Most people "overestimate" their intelligence, but ONLY a person who can "torear" stupid people is truly a mastermind!
I am, by NO stretch of anyone's imagination, that person!
Note: I mentioned this in 2023 here: receive high amount of money
Luckily, we ALL have different tastes.
(2) @saintjohnny has a wonderful family and friends that he loves and loves him back, and he prefers a place where there is a soul devoid of pretentious people. (Can't blame him for this - I already mentioned I tried this with my mom, but she refused). The wealth (family & friends) @saintjohnny has is actually MUCH BETTER than money or financial wealth!
I do NOT have this type of "wealth"! My ONLY loved person, my mom, has passed away (recently) as a centenarian!
(3) @JohnnyDoe has incredible stratospheric social intelligence (in addition to the regular IQ intelligence). He can wade through locals/natives like nothing! I once heard a very wealthy Spaniard refer to this talent as "El don de torear a los pendejos."
(Roughly translated in English = "The gift of bullfighting idiots."The intelligence required to pull this off is comparable to Leonardo da Vinci's or Michelangelo's! It's f*cking rare AF!
I can NOT do this! I am NOT that smart!
If you do NOT understand this, may I, ONCE AGAIN, veer you towards reading this book from Carlo M. Cipolla:
(A) Allegro ma non troppo con Le leggi fondamentali della stupidità umana. (Italian version)
(B) The Basic Laws of Human Stupidity! (English version)
Most people "overestimate" their intelligence, but ONLY a person who can "torear" stupid people is truly a mastermind!
I am, by NO stretch of anyone's imagination, that person!
Note: I mentioned this in 2023 here: receive high amount of money
Financial institution isnt really such a big problem when not being tax resident anywhere. There are so many options available:Educate me dear sir,
-You can be a resident but not tax resident in many countries and open bank accounts with such an address. For example you can be a resident in the UAE (or Paraguay or Panama or Mexico), open local accounts there, as well as foreign accounts with your UAE/Panama/Paraguay/Mexico address like with for example Xapo.
-You can open a foreign company, like a US LLC, and open bank accounts for that company. There are tons of EMIs in the US and around the world where one can open bank accounts for a US LLC.
-In many western countries if you have once lived there, and opened a bank account while you lived there, you can keep the bank account even when you move abroad, and even if you arent a tax resident in any place abroad. This doesnt work in countries where a bank account is a tie that counts for tax residency like in the Netherlands, but works great in many countries like the UK.
-You can register as a resident in a suitable EU/Western country, open a bunch of Bank/EMI accounts with this address (there are 100s to choose from), and then move out before you become a tax resident. Then you can just keep using the country you opened the account in as your tax residency if the banks asks. They will report info to this country, and the country will see you are not a tax resident and do nothing. The account will not be closed - I know people who have been doing this for over a decade.
-You can open a dedicated offshore account with like HSBC or Barclays. They understand if you have residency in an odd country. So you can get an address in a total third world country in Africa or somewhere where governments dont really check things very much, there is no such thing as a personal tax return, and no real concept of tax vs non tax resident, and the country is not part of any information sharing agreements.
So the address in the third world country is now your official address and tax residency for the offshore HSBC/Barclays/other account. This also works in the previous point with a bank you opened in a western country when you lived there.
Like now i live in the Central African Republic, here is my address, deal with it!
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How would that work for something like this then? Opening A Bank Account In Netherlands Without Residency Proof
PS. I know several people from the EU (not Dutch) with bank accounts in the Netherlands. Would they get taxed in the Netherlands?
The Netherlands uses a long list of not clerly defined ties to determine tax residency. Bank account is one such tie. They look at the overall picture, so having a dutch bank account doesn't necessarily mean you become a dutch tax resident. But if I was dutch and wanted to leave the country and stop being a dutch tax resident, I would have closed all my dutch bank accounts to be on the safe side.
By the way, as an experiment, while living in multiple countries whereof none in Europe, I opened an account at a european EMI using a mail forwarding address in an EU country that I dont live in. I got a card to the mail forwarding address, sent it to myself (at a hotel outside Europe). Then I changed my address at the EMI to my old address when I lived in Switzerland around a decade ago. And so far, I can use the EMI without any issues at all. Curious to see if I ever get issues with the EMI.
I feel this is the KEY!
Tax residency is akin to marriage!
Once married, the divorce WILL be costly!
So, it's best NEVER to be a tax resident of that sh1thole! I will pass this information on to my European suppliers and clients with Dutch bank accounts.
Thank you for sharing!
Where do you live? You've obfuscated that and apparently dislike every place so it is very curiosity invoking to know where you currently reside. You appear to be having some sort of regret with your decision as you need to validate it with these simply inaccurate statements.
It is clear why you do not fit in and see the French Rivera as overrated. Firstly, the French Riveria is a vacation spot. To somehow discredit it for not being a tech hub (the worlds tech hub is Silicon Valley, which you likely know, and it is a literal s**t hole with one half being a typical American suburb and the other being a city, San Francisco, overrun with junkies and homeless people with the highest tax bracket being around 62%) is moronic.
The Rivera for 100+ years been the most elite vacation destination in the world for world elites for multiple reasons including natural beauty, entertainment, gastronomy, and the fact that it is so close to the industrial and financial centers of Europe. Nobody lives there full-time, they visit for the summer. Almost every city on the Riveria short of some small parts of Marselle which you'd never visit are pristinely clean. "Gucci hat wearers", whatever that even means, there are actually very few people that wear ostentatious gaudy designer clothes, most wear stealth wealth brands such as Loro Piana and or wear tailored clothing most often made of linen.
Have you been any historic beach clubs like Le Club 55, La Plage Keller, or any of the vaunted Michelin star restaurants in Monaco or Provence such as Baumanière? If you have, you would've never made the simply inaccurate statement. The crowds are absolutely not shallow, most are from large cities in Europe, most have careers in finance, tech, or have businesses, in fact there are many families with children at these establishments.
You seemed to have gotten very poor advice and are the typical small business owner that made an impulsive decision to relocate to save some money in taxes not realizing that to fully enjoy and realize the potential of tax optimization you have to consider the fact you will need to have multiple residencies and live in two different places at a minimum. Monaco is not dirty, the infrastructure is anything but poor. As for shady people, that an opinion, not a fact, Monaco is one of the safest places on earth, the saying holds true in any capital city "behind every fortune is a crime". Most Monaco residents spend at the most 3-4 months in Monaco, enjoy the events, beach clubs, restaurants, and the rest of the time are in another home.
It is clear why you do not fit in and see the French Rivera as overrated. Firstly, the French Riveria is a vacation spot. To somehow discredit it for not being a tech hub (the worlds tech hub is Silicon Valley, which you likely know, and it is a literal s**t hole with one half being a typical American suburb and the other being a city, San Francisco, overrun with junkies and homeless people with the highest tax bracket being around 62%) is moronic.
The Rivera for 100+ years been the most elite vacation destination in the world for world elites for multiple reasons including natural beauty, entertainment, gastronomy, and the fact that it is so close to the industrial and financial centers of Europe. Nobody lives there full-time, they visit for the summer. Almost every city on the Riveria short of some small parts of Marselle which you'd never visit are pristinely clean. "Gucci hat wearers", whatever that even means, there are actually very few people that wear ostentatious gaudy designer clothes, most wear stealth wealth brands such as Loro Piana and or wear tailored clothing most often made of linen.
Have you been any historic beach clubs like Le Club 55, La Plage Keller, or any of the vaunted Michelin star restaurants in Monaco or Provence such as Baumanière? If you have, you would've never made the simply inaccurate statement. The crowds are absolutely not shallow, most are from large cities in Europe, most have careers in finance, tech, or have businesses, in fact there are many families with children at these establishments.
You seemed to have gotten very poor advice and are the typical small business owner that made an impulsive decision to relocate to save some money in taxes not realizing that to fully enjoy and realize the potential of tax optimization you have to consider the fact you will need to have multiple residencies and live in two different places at a minimum. Monaco is not dirty, the infrastructure is anything but poor. As for shady people, that an opinion, not a fact, Monaco is one of the safest places on earth, the saying holds true in any capital city "behind every fortune is a crime". Most Monaco residents spend at the most 3-4 months in Monaco, enjoy the events, beach clubs, restaurants, and the rest of the time are in another home.
Lol. You just proved my point. You sound like the typical Riviera wannabe fanboy that's never been an actual resident. Those clubs you mentioned are rancid.
And by the way, you clearly lack imagination (and boots on the ground experience) if you didn't get the Gucci hat-wearing "pension-payer" line. I was referring to a totally different demographic that anyone with half a brain and a few days in the Riviera would get.
I'm quite happy with my decision of leaving that part of the world, don't worry about me pal, it's all good. I'll go work on my small biz now and be happy. Cheers sir.
Edit: And good luck getting your Carte de Sejour by staying in Monaco for 3-4 months. Again, your lack of experience is blatantly obvious.
3-4 months? If the authorities notice you're not around Monaco +183 days in a year expect to be in big trouble
The dude doesn't know what he's talking about. D*ck riding a jurisdiction he knows nothing about. Sad!
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