Trump Speaks with Putin – The Obvious Reality Finally Dawns

[polonieth]

I was in two minds about whether to bother posting about this, as I assume most of the forum members who said I was a Russian propagandist for saying Ukraine is an unwinnable proxy war that should never have been started are no longer here now that they're not getting paid. But anyway...

I can't believe there are still people in Ukraine and the EU who are sincerely surprised at an obvious fact that was clear from day one of the war—this affair will be concluded by negotiations between Russia and the USA. No one else’s “opinion” has ever mattered, and it never will.

Now that Trump has spoken with Putin, it should be clear to anyone paying attention: the game is up. All the cope, all the delusions about some grand Ukrainian victory, all the fantasy about “isolating” Russia—it was never real. The end result was always going to be dictated by Washington and Moscow, and now the grown-ups are talking.

The reason European leaders are losing it over Trump isn’t because of some dramatic shift in US foreign policy either. The war will end the way it was always going to end. What really hurts them is that Washington has stopped pretending that Europe is a meaningful participant in current geopolitical affairs. They used to at least get some ceremonial respect, some scripted role in the imperial play. Now? Trump isn’t even giving them that lol.

For decades, US vassals in Europe at lest got to cosplay as being important—being spoken to with fake diplomatic pleasantries, being allowed to maintain the illusion that their opinions carried weight. That was part of the unspoken contract between Washington and Brussels. Biden at least kept up the act. Trump? He doesn’t even entertain the role-playing anymore. He’s consolidating the core imperial possessions, and if that means letting the European satraps know they’re just administrators of regional tax farms, so be it.

And that’s what’s actually humiliating for them. Not some fundamental shift in US foreign policy, which isn’t nearly as dramatic as they make it sound, but the fact that they’re being openly treated as the irrelevant, powerless dependents they always were. The US doesn’t need their input. Russia certainly doesn’t care about their input. And the war ends when the actual players decide it ends.

You will still hear the clowns like Kallas, Von Der Leyen etc pipe up with stupid posturing but yeah, game over for Europe. SOY!

PS: Look at electricity prices in the Baltics!

 

[cherry]

I got banned from the Autosport Forum effectively for saying normal, reasonable things about the Russian issues that the British and Europeans of the Woke persuasion thought was tantamount to fascism. I wonder what what they're saying now, but it was a non-public section of the forum so I can't see it. I'm sure they're still in complete denial about the whole conflict.

 

[JohnnyDoe]

You will still hear the clowns like Kallas, Von Der Leyen etc

Useful idiots. It’s nice to be America today when you can control these decerebrate puppets.

 

[Konstanz]

Why is so very important for some people that Russia win something?
Is it some dream country were people flock near their borders to get in?

I guess most of such people either naive and romanticize Russia , have husband/wife being Russian or simply are Russian.

 

[daniels27]

Why is so very important for some people that Russia win something?
Is it some dream country were people flock near their borders to get in?

No. They make one big mistake. The enemy of your enemy is not your friend either. If you don't agree with western politics, it does not mean that Putin likes you.

And the second mistake many make: if there is a proxy war between China and the US on Russian and Ukrainian territory, you first need to win on the battlefield before you can face your adversary. Pulling out puts your weakness on the table.

China is just waiting to see how much you can gain in a war before they attack. If Trump really wants to face China, he needs to battle in Ukraine.

But what we care? The US is going down while China is raising. Good news is that on the example of Europe and the US, you can see that it takes many decades ahead being surpassed until irrelevance.

New:
China: power
US: benefiting from previous power
Europe: irrelevance

I guess most of such people either naive and romanticize Russia , have husband/wife being Russian or simply are Russian.

Girls sell. Aren't there many here with USSR chicks Egypt they profit from business in the US?

 

[Konstanz]

No. They make one big mistake. The enemy of your enemy is not your friend either. If you don't agree with western politics, it does not mean that Putin likes you.

And the second mistake many make: if there is a proxy war between China and the US on Russian and Ukrainian territory, you first need to win on the battlefield before you can face your adversary. Pulling out puts your weakness on the table.

China is just waiting to see how much Roy can gain in a war before they attack. If trump really wants to face China, he needs to battle in Ukraine.


Girls sell. Aren't there many here with USSR chicks Egypt they profit from business in the US?

Agree 100%. "If you don't agree with western politics, it does not mean that Putin likes you."

If Trump just give Ukraine out, it will just give more motivation to Putin to start new wars. It will not be no more "Make America Great Again"

 

[Alonzo]

If Trump just give Ukraine out, it will just give more motivation to Putin to start new wars. It will not be no more "Make America Great Again"

In Trump’s peace plan, he did not mention to withdraw Russian troops from the occupied territories. Ukrainian troops however have to leave Kursk thus go back home.

So my guess is as soon as Trump leaves office (and assuming Democrats takes control after) Putin will resume the war. Pretty much a temporary halt from all that money spent on defense.

 

[Konstanz]

In Trump’s peace plan, he did not mention to withdraw Russian troops from the occupied territories.

So my guess is as soon as Trump leaves office (and assuming Democrats takes control after) Putin will resume the war. Pretty much a temporary halt from all that money spent on defense.

Putin will probably test NATO. Most probably Baltic countries.
If US wanted this war would even have not started
I don't know maybe EU/US look at Ukraine a bit different than to other European countries. Maybe they consider big part of Ukraine be part of "Russian world". I talk about East Ukraine.

 

[polonieth]

It’s interesting how people misinterpret entirely what’s being said. I’m not advocating for Russia to “win” something, nor do I have any personal attachment to Russia. I am pointing out what has been evident from the start: the war would be settled between Russia and the US, with Europe playing no meaningful role. That’s just a reality check, not some ideological position.

It’s telling how some people desperately need to frame any recognition of geopolitical reality as some pro-Russian sentiment. I don’t romanticise Russia, but it's obviously not just some "gas station with nuclear weapons", and I have been pointing out for years that Ukraine is the most corrupt country in Europe, run by an oligarch-backed leader, with zero democracy, rigged elections, and rampant state-sanctioned theft. Why would I back that? The difference is, I don’t buy into the delusional idea that Ukraine was ever going to "win" a war against a nuclear superpower with a vastly superior industrial base. Anyone with a brain knew how this was going to end.

As for the comments about China above, this is another completely backward take I keep seeing this idea that China is watching Ukraine as a test run for war with the US. China is not some expansionist, war-hungry empire. When has China ever pursued foreign wars thousands of miles away? Where are their colonial holdings? How many overseas military bases do they have? The only one that’s even debatable is in Djibouti, and that’s a supply depot, not an outpost for military adventurism.

Do you guys not realise that when Xi wakes up in the morning, he’s not strategising how to go to war with America? He’s trying to keep a country of over a billion people together. The real struggle for China isn’t war; it’s managing an economy with an ageing population, debt bubbles, and a collapsing real estate sector. China is not on some unstoppable rise; its economic trajectory is stagnating, and if anything, it is far more vulnerable than most people assume.

As for the resumption of war, if the Democrats are back in 2028. You have it in reverse, the war would resume because if Trump fails to remove all the neo-con neomarxist globalist warmongers, then it will be a return to the CFR type presidency.

But isn't this logic completely contradictory? I thought Trump was supposed to be a "fascist" dictator who was going to destroy democracy in America? Now he’s the one stopping wars? Pick a narrative guys please.

The reality is that Trump has good instincts regarding geopolitics (he still has some bad advisors), but it's far better than the people currently running Washington. He sees the corruption, he knows that endless funding to Ukraine is a money-laundering operation for the military-industrial complex, and he’s not interested in keeping the grift going. The American people are waking up to how corrupt the Democrats are, and if Trump follows through on his plans to clean out the Deep State, that’s a win for everyone.

And what he’s doing with the DOGE is exactly what should be happening—getting rid of the entrenched bureaucratic corruption that has hijacked the US government.

Putin will test Nato?

Where do people get this nonsense? There is zero evidence that Russia wants to attack the Baltics. Show me one profound statement from Russia that indicates this is a goal. It’s a complete fantasy cooked up by people who want to keep the military-industrial complex well-fed.

Think logically; Russia is already the largest country in the world. It has an incredibly diverse population, with vast regions that are difficult to govern. Why would they want to take on tiny, economically insignificant "countries" that would bring no strategic or economic benefit? The Baltics are NATO’s problem, not Russia’s opportunity.

The only thing that has driven Russia into a more aggressive stance is the West’s constant antagonism—NATO expansion, sanctions, and blatant attempts to destabilise the country. If Europe had any competent leadership, they would have made deals with Russia years ago instead of setting themselves up for economic ruin.

Look at electricity prices in the Baltics. Look at inflation across Europe. Look at Germany’s collapsing economy. The EU has made itself irrelevant by choosing to be Washington’s puppet instead of acting in its own interest.

And now that Trump is back, Washington isn’t even pretending to care about Europe anymore. That’s what really hurts Brussels—not some radical shift in US foreign policy, but the fact that they’re finally being treated like the irrelevant bureaucrats they are.

The war is ending the way it was always going to end—with Washington and Moscow making a deal, while the EU cries from the sidelines.

 

[avalanche]

Putin will test Nato?

Where do people get this nonsense?

From a propaganda playbook. Otherwise how would current Ukrainian gov convince the world they need more money?

 

[no1d]

Look at Germany’s collapsing economy.

At the same time the Russian economy is thriving, haha

 

[daniels27]

At the same time the Russian economy is thriving, haha

And China. They recently reported again like 6% growth.

Guys. Read the books. War serves its purpose to destroy surplus production capacity. We need to keep the ear going.

 

[no1d]

Putin will test Nato?

Where do people get this nonsense? There is zero evidence that Russia wants to attack the Baltics.

Agree, Russia couldn't even conquer Ukraine and some people are already thinking they will invade Europe. But if they could no doubt they'll take the Baltics, just for their ego.

 

[cherry]

I don't think Russia or China are war-like. They're not the USA. China wants trade with the world, while Russia seems isolationist and just wants the West to stop thinking it's still the Cold War.

 

[polonieth]

And China. They recently reported again like 6% growth.

Guys. Read the books. War serves its purpose to destroy surplus production capacity. We need to keep the ear going.

Of course, they report growth.

House prices in many cities are down -60% since 2021, and commodities volumes are down massively ~40%, yet you believe the economy is growing at 6%??

 

[polonieth]

Agree, Russia couldn't even conquer Ukraine and some people are already thinking they will invade Europe. But if they could no doubt they'll take the Baltics, just for their ego.

Conquer Ukraine? When was that ever floated as one of their aims? How would that have been achieved with the limited forces they used February '22?

 

[John Spectre]

Again bunch of assumptions and bla bla bla.
Trump had one call with putin and already 100500 useless ideas how war should finish.
Actually nothing in battlefield have changed. And until then - it's a just a words.

'Go f**k youself' it's a words by famous eloni, but any: EU, putin, Zelenski could now easy say to Trump

And just for debunk these so-called unbiased people who wrote paragraphs of propaganda, I'll just quote a sentence where every couple of words is a portion of a lie:

and I have been pointing out for years that Ukraine is the most corrupt country in Europe, run by an oligarch-backed leader, with zero democracy, rigged elections, and rampant state-sanctioned theft.

1. 'most corrupt country in Europe'
Not the most. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index
Belarus, Macedonia etc are more corrupt in europe. even russia have much bigger corruption, but it don't mean anything when you need to negotiate with specific country about the war.

2.'run by an oligarch-backed leader'
Assumption that Zelenskiy run by Kolomoyskiy- Kolomoysky effectively in prison for a years already
https://kyivindependent.com/kolomoiskys-detention-extended-bail-reduced/
And also recently sanctions was imposed against Kolomoysky's assets
https://www.golosameriki.com/a/sanc...poroshenko-and-other-businessmen/7974215.html

3.'with zero democracy'
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Economist_Democracy_Index
Ukraine literally in the middle on world rating which is not even near to '0 democracy'.
Not near to 'Authoritarian regimes' list, but russia is there

4.'rigged elections'
Not a single one election was rigged that change winner except 2004 that cause re election.
But it was 20+ years ago with russia intervention.

So everyone need to double check every single word of puppets who are starting to repeat someone propaganda before take attention to his words.

 

[polonieth]

Again bunch of assumptions and bla bla bla.
Trump had one call with putin and already 100500 useless ideas how war should finish.
Actually nothing in battlefield have changed. And until then - it's a just a words.

'Go f**k youself' it's a words by famous eloni, but any: EU, putin, Zelenski could now easy say to Trump

And just for debunk these so-called unbiased people who wrote paragraphs of propaganda, I'll just quote a sentence where every couple of words is a portion of a lie:



1. 'most corrupt country in Europe'
Not the most. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index
Belarus, Macedonia etc are more corrupt in europe. even russia have much bigger corruption, but it don't mean anything when you need to negotiate with specific country about the war.

2.'run by an oligarch-backed leader'
Assumption that Zelenskiy run by Kolomoyskiy- Kolomoysky effectively in prison for a years already
https://kyivindependent.com/kolomoiskys-detention-extended-bail-reduced/
And also recently sanctions was imposed against Kolomoysky's assets
https://www.golosameriki.com/a/sanc...poroshenko-and-other-businessmen/7974215.html

3.'with zero democracy'
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Economist_Democracy_Index
Ukraine literally in the middle on world rating which is not even near to '0 democracy'.
Not near to 'Authoritarian regimes' list, but russia is there

4.'rigged elections'
Not a single one election was rigged that change winner except 2004 that cause re election.
But it was 20+ years ago with russia intervention.

So everyone need to double check every single word of puppets who are starting to repeat someone propaganda before take attention to his words.

Ah yes, another Ukrainian from the keyboard battalion giving us the latest wisdom from the trenches.

"Bla bla bla, assumptions, just words"

The irony of this statement is incredible, given that your entire response is a series of assumptions, cherry-picked Wikipedia links, and outright cope. But let’s go through your points one by one.

1. "Trump had one call with Putin and suddenly people are making assumptions about how the war will end."

You’re missing the point completely. The call isn’t the cause of the war’s inevitable resolution, it’s just another signal that Washington and Moscow will ultimately decide the outcome. That was obvious from the start.

And what do you mean "nothing has changed on the battlefield"? Ukraine is in full defensive mode, NATO is running out of ammo to send you, 1+ million lost. Russia is still there, still pushing, still outproducing Ukraine in shells, missiles, and manpower. But sure, "nothing has changed."

2. "Go fk yourself" – some vague attempt at bravado**

Great! Let me know when your side can actually dictate terms to anyone. So far, the only thing Ukraine has successfully done is send an entire generation of men to die in a meat grinder while Western politicians laugh and move on to the next funding package.

And no, neither the EU, Putin, nor Zelensky can tell Trump to get lost. The entire EU project depends on Washington, Zelensky is entirely propped up by Western aid, and even Putin understands that Trump being back is a game-changer. Pretending that Ukraine is in a position to dismiss Trump is just delusional. The war ends when Washington stops paying for it. That’s reality.

3. "Ukraine is not the most corrupt country in Europe"

Ah yes, how great! So Ukraine isn’t technically the most corrupt country in Europe if you go by the Corruption Perceptions Index, which is compiled from surveys and not actual investigative work. But sure, let’s assume for a second that Ukraine isn't number one in corruption. It’s still right up there with the worst, and more importantly, it’s corrupt in the exact ways that make negotiations with them worthless.

Where’s all that foreign aid money gone mate??? Why are military supplies being resold on the black market and showing up in Mexico? Why are Ukrainian officials getting caught buying luxury cars and villas while the average Ukrainian is forced into conscription? The fact that you have to split hairs about "most corrupt" vs. "one of the most corrupt" just proves my point.

4. "Zelensky isn't backed by oligarchs because Kolomoysky is in prison"

This is the funniest argument yet. Just because Kolomoysky got thrown under the bus after backing Zelensky doesn’t mean Zelensky isn’t a puppet. He rode into power on Kolomoysky’s media empire. The guy was a literal TV actor on a show owned by Kolomoysky lol.

Also, let’s not pretend like putting an oligarch in jail changes anything about how Ukraine is run. A single high-profile arrest doesn’t erase the fact that the government is still run by oligarchs who just learned how to play the game better. Who’s still running all the business and media structures in Ukraine? The same corrupt class, just with some reshuffling at the top.

5. "Ukraine has democracy!"

Oh, you mean the country that:

• Banned opposition parties
• Censored media outlets
• Arrested political opponents
• Postponed elections indefinitely

If you want to call that a democracy, then North Korea must be a constitutional republic by your logic. The Economist’s Democracy Index is just another arbitrary list made by people who still think Ukraine is some bastion of "European values." Meanwhile, Zelensky has consolidated more power than any Ukrainian leader in modern history. The only reason he hasn’t rigged an election is because he’s not even allowing one to happen.

6. "Not a single Ukrainian election was rigged"

Except for the one in 2004, which you admit was rigged. But don’t worry, it was only 20 years ago—nothing to see here!

And that’s just the one that was so obvious it had to be redone. What about the electoral fraud in other years? The fact that Western-backed candidates mysteriously always get in? The fact that in every election, massive amounts of foreign money (hint USAID funding NGOs) flood into Ukraine to shape the results? Ukraine’s "elections" have been so heavily managed by external actors that calling them fair is laughable. Our boy Yatz!

 

[John Spectre]

Ah yes, another Ukrainian from the keyboard battalion giving us the latest wisdom from the trenches

Very nice that you got personal in your very first answer.

However, I quoted you not to start a dialogue, but simply to show other users that your words (and the words of other people like you) are full of lies and deceit.

I told you a couple of years ago that I am not interested in dialogues with you. Nothing has changed since then.

 

[cherry]

Ukraine were caught in the middle of a USA/Russia proxy war. They may be a highly corrupt country, but their people are the victims in this conflict. Trump's intervention will ensure no more Ukrainians or Russians die. Had Ukraine been allowed to sign Minsk 2 in 2022, Ukraine would still have its old land and nearly 1 million men still alive. USA lost its proxy war, let's now end this crappy conflict. People who had Ukrainian flags in their bios were useful idiots in all this.