He stopped replying to my messages in telegram.
I was able to confirm that they allow as long as you can pass the CM-Equity AG KYC. I have no idea about how hard would be that.
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Setup for Crypto and Stock trading
- Thread starter Dom pedro
- Start date
So try some of the many others around here like @Gediminas , @Fred @AlexPCS and so on... there are many
If you look in the mentor group you can even find Interviews with some of them, means, you can see the person behind a service on a video!
Really funny guys -- I thought 'Im the only one' with these specific questions (thats at least the impression I got when I asked different advisors and they looked at me with big open eyes) and saw you in exact same place.
Great to brain-storm together
Basically the trade-off I see for now is the following:
x - US LLC pros:
- No accounting/audit as non US resident
- Stocks: Possibility to open IBKR account
- Possibility to open a bank account
x - US LLC cons:
- Crypto: Cant open Binance/FTX accounts and Binance US/FTX US not an option due to lack of important features
- Stocks: If using US LLC to trade US stocks/options/futures, need to pay US taxes as generated in the US
x - BVI pros:
- no accounting/audits
- Crypto: Possibility to open FTX/Binance accounts (in theory)
- Stocks: IFFF one could open an IBKR account (or with similar broker) profits would be tax free
x - BVI cons:
- Issue opening bank accounts (apart possibly with Signature/Silvergate Bank)
- Stocks: Potentially not be able to open IBKR account
Are the above the trade-offs you'd also see?
I mean 'worst case' I'd open BVI or similar for Crypto and US LLC for Crypto.
Problem here may be that BVI wont be able to open an IBKR account and as such would need an entity which would be able to do that....
Great to brain-storm together
Basically the trade-off I see for now is the following:
x - US LLC pros:
- No accounting/audit as non US resident
- Stocks: Possibility to open IBKR account
- Possibility to open a bank account
x - US LLC cons:
- Crypto: Cant open Binance/FTX accounts and Binance US/FTX US not an option due to lack of important features
- Stocks: If using US LLC to trade US stocks/options/futures, need to pay US taxes as generated in the US
x - BVI pros:
- no accounting/audits
- Crypto: Possibility to open FTX/Binance accounts (in theory)
- Stocks: IFFF one could open an IBKR account (or with similar broker) profits would be tax free
x - BVI cons:
- Issue opening bank accounts (apart possibly with Signature/Silvergate Bank)
- Stocks: Potentially not be able to open IBKR account
Are the above the trade-offs you'd also see?
I mean 'worst case' I'd open BVI or similar for Crypto and US LLC for Crypto.
Problem here may be that BVI wont be able to open an IBKR account and as such would need an entity which would be able to do that....
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Thanks for the reply Phantom. That's almost exactly my line of thought so far. Only one correction: you will not pay taxes for capital gains in stocks and derivatives of US stocks, even with a US LLC. These gains are not counted as income coming from US. You will play however the 30% tax withholding from dividends received by US companies. The rules are the same as if you are trading with a personal account as a foreigner.
Wow DomP, excellent news with the US LLC for trading.
'I thought' as this income would be generated in the US when trading with US stocks, options, futures etc, then it would be taxed...
The dividend WHT (withholding tax) would not be an issue for me.
I assume with a US LLC its quite possible to open brokerage accounts.
I got told that once the LLC has an account, then it would be also possible to get a private account as well.
Friends told me they prefer the Wyoming LLC, but I do not have a view yet for that.
Do you by chance have an opinion regarding LLCs for trading if there are better states to do so?
If stock, options, futures, FX work well with US LLC, then trading Crypto would be best with BVI imho.
The reason for that is that with BVI Ltd, onboarding on Crypto Exchanges should be no issue as BVI structures are common.
Crypto Exchanges also onboard 'more offshore' entities like Seychelles etc, but its nearly impossible to get bank accounts with them.
At Silvergate / Signature bank, they offer Bank accounts for BVI Co -- I wrote to them and both confirmed they do.
So, 'in theory' it seems, US LLC and BVI should be best combo --- I'll go for that and give it a shot.
If there are any ideas what to pay special attention too I'd be happy to hear to not make so many mistakes
Hi,Really funny guys -- I thought 'Im the only one' with these specific questions (thats at least the impression I got when I asked different advisors and they looked at me with big open eyes) and saw you in exact same place.
Great to brain-storm together
Basically the trade-off I see for now is the following:
x - US LLC pros:
- No accounting/audit as non US resident
- Stocks: Possibility to open IBKR account
- Possibility to open a bank account
x - US LLC cons:
- Crypto: Cant open Binance/FTX accounts and Binance US/FTX US not an option due to lack of important features
- Stocks: If using US LLC to trade US stocks/options/futures, need to pay US taxes as generated in the US
x - BVI pros:
- no accounting/audits
- Crypto: Possibility to open FTX/Binance accounts (in theory)
- Stocks: IFFF one could open an IBKR account (or with similar broker) profits would be tax free
x - BVI cons:
- Issue opening bank accounts (apart possibly with Signature/Silvergate Bank)
- Stocks: Potentially not be able to open IBKR account
Are the above the trade-offs you'd also see?
I mean 'worst case' I'd open BVI or similar for Crypto and US LLC for Crypto.
Problem here may be that BVI wont be able to open an IBKR account and as such would need an entity which would be able to do that....
Just wondering if you have compared BVI with other “cheaper” jurisdictions like Seychelles or Belize. Any reason why you prefer BVI over the other two?
In my opinion Seychelles/Belize will nearly be impossible to open bank accounts (specially if Crypto is involved)
Cayman/BVI pretty easy to open corporate Crypto Bank accounts with the usual suspect crypto banks
Hey Phantom. I am sorry for this late reply. Unfortunately Brazil is undergoing a tax reform and there are many things that we don't know yet, but it seems that in the current proposal citizens will be required to pay taxes of the annual profits of companies located in countries considered "tax havens". Currently I would only pay taxes on the dividends received by this company. I am not sure or not if a Delaware LLC could be considered a tax haven or not.
As for the best US state to open an LLC, it seems that Delaware and Wyoming offers the most liability protection for the owner. Delaware is the one with most available services (lots of registered agents, proof of address schemes, virtual offices, etc..) but Wyoming is cheaper and can be anonymous if you want. If I go the wyoming route I would prefer to not be anonymous as it is harder to open a bank account this way.
What are the usual suspect crypto banks? Silvergate and Signature or can you recommend others?
For the LLCs for stocks trading, you can incorporate with incfile.com for $150 + state fee and get a business account with Bank of America.
Thank you for the incfile. What would be the advantage to go with agents like legalzoom and such?
Regarding the banks, yes Silvergate/Signature are great as they have insta settlement of the cash leg if you do arb.
However, other banks for BVI Cos are for example Swiss Crypto Focused Banks like SEBA or Sygnum.
Alternatively if you just need random on/off fiat ramps, you could onboard your BVI Co with an OTC broker and then its very easy to get money in/out and fees most likely cheaper than most exchanges depending on size etc..
Bank Frick or these types will charge you completely loco fees and imho not worth it as long as you got other alternatives
In terms of opening a bank account, would it be better to incorporate in Deleware or BVI? You didn't mention anything about opening a bank in the pros/cons of a US LLC.Really funny guys -- I thought 'Im the only one' with these specific questions (thats at least the impression I got when I asked different advisors and they looked at me with big open eyes) and saw you in exact same place.
Great to brain-storm together
Basically the trade-off I see for now is the following:
x - US LLC pros:
- No accounting/audit as non US resident
- Stocks: Possibility to open IBKR account
- Possibility to open a bank account
x - US LLC cons:
- Crypto: Cant open Binance/FTX accounts and Binance US/FTX US not an option due to lack of important features
- Stocks: If using US LLC to trade US stocks/options/futures, need to pay US taxes as generated in the US
x - BVI pros:
- no accounting/audits
- Crypto: Possibility to open FTX/Binance accounts (in theory)
- Stocks: IFFF one could open an IBKR account (or with similar broker) profits would be tax free
x - BVI cons:
- Issue opening bank accounts (apart possibly with Signature/Silvergate Bank)
- Stocks: Potentially not be able to open IBKR account
Are the above the trade-offs you'd also see?
I mean 'worst case' I'd open BVI or similar for Crypto and US LLC for Crypto.
Problem here may be that BVI wont be able to open an IBKR account and as such would need an entity which would be able to do that....
What about crypto companies? No bank in the US allows bank account opening for crypto companies no matter what location they are incorporated. What would your advice be for a crypto company incorporated in the US that wants to open a bank account.
me personally I wouldnt open a Crypto related trading company in the US as you wont get access to full Binance or FTX etc.
My setup is BVI for Crypto and US LLC for 'normal markets' trading
Banking with BVI Crypto Co with US based Silvergate/Signature Bank no problem
US Delaware LLC for 'normal trading'
Delaware US LLC because lots of financial companies best to setup LLC vs Wyoming or so as you'd need to declare UBO anyways)
If you have a US Crypto Company, speak with Silvergate/Signature -- however, to my best knowledge with US crypto Company can only use Binance US or FTX US which have very limited options --- plus, eventually you may run into regulation issues going forward
yes, just much more limited amount of underlyings, products and leverage and such
if you just want to trade majors then you could go with them but fees are higher for active trading vs FTX or Binance
It won't be for crypto trading. The company itself will be an actual crypto exchange (similar to Binance and FTX) with advanced trading platforms. We have a team currently building it and it's due to launch soon. Would the BVI co with US-based silvergate/signature method work in this case?
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