Those days are gone.
If you are truly in corporate services then you ought to know better. Nevertheless, good luck
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Setting Up an Anonymous, Low-Cost Tax-Free Company Globally in 2024 with Minimal Compliance Requirements?
- Thread starter happyjohn
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If you are truly in corporate services then you ought to know better. Nevertheless, good luck
So i'm curious now with all those years of experience why a Panama resident wouldn't be able to open a US bank account by going in person to a branch.
They will continue to be the world's biggest tax haven for non-us citizens, that will not change.
Also, you don't have to jump immediately from EU high tax country to Panama, you could add an intermediate step and move to Cyprus first (for example) and then from there to Panama.
Where did I say that a Panamanian resident wouldn't be able to open a US account? You can open the US account if you manage to jump through all the hoops and over all the hurdles, like anywhere else. In some states walking into a branch and walk out with an account isn't happening anymore. In some states that is still possible.
It becomes however challenging to not declare those bankaccounts and get away with it. Is it a major risk if it is just a passthrough account? No not directly. Indirectly it becomes an issue once information requests are issued. Also if such an account doesn't hold >150k I don't think there will be an immediate risk. There are bigger fish in the pond.
Latest info is that the US is starting to exchange requested information by foreign nations. Panama is already doing that for a good handful of years. Ive personally seen dozens of requests passing my desk since 2017-2018-ish.
You didn't say explicitly that a Panamian resident wouldn't be able to open a US bank account but implied that it will be a very hard task to get one.
But why should you be worried about having a US bank account as a Panama resident I don't understant. You don't have anything to hide.
Yes, and that doesnt change. If you however jump the hoops etc you might be able to get a US bankaccount (it largely depends on the state/county nowadays). Jumping the hoops means presenting ID, Proof of Address and in some cases Source of Funds. Sometimes, with higher amounts a second form of ID is already asked for in the US by certain banks.
If you declare everything correctly in Panama - nothing to hide as you say and insofar obliged to declare - then there is no problem in Panama. What I wrote before was and is in the context of "anonymity and low compliance" (see the title of this thread). Given that you used ID etc when opening, it is not anonymous and also not low compliance. Low compliance depends on a whole different subset of criteria and largely is user influenced.
On a side note, given that Panama (and partly the USA) nowadays complies with information requests, then your high tax home country (the one where you were born and hold the passport off) might even try to tax you when they find out that you don't pay tax anywhere else. Situations like that are currently happening in multiple countries in Europe.
Those hoops are becoming the norm to open a bank account pretty much everywhere.
A US LLC is still an anonymous public facing company, only the IRS knows who is behind a company and with no accounting, no taxes to pay in US, you only need to file form 5472 this is very low compliance.
If with "anonymity" he was talking about was about hiding ownership to governments and banks then this is very different topic.
Based on current legislation it is not wise to skip accounting. The jurisdiction of incorporation might not require it (although that changes as well. The Seychelles was for instance a jurisdiction that didnt require accounts being kept. That changed drastically over the last couple of years), banks do or will soon do, based on global AML-CT legislation. The good ole US of A is slowly following this trend.
If anonymity is used to avoid having your name show up in public registers, sure, that will work. The title of this thread suggests imo a little more than that. Its also not just the USA offering this service. In Switzerland you can incorporate an AG and the shareholders registers are not public. Similarly you would remain anonymous. Im sure there are more countries offering similar options.
very true, set me back to 2009 and let me restart and I would be a billionaire today.
You, me and everyone else on this forum would all have bought btc. No offshoring needed.
Short answer: They do not.
Long answer:
There are different people posting here. Those with less than 10 posts and asking such thing are usually French or Germans that once read in a newspaper about the big companies not paying taxes, "stealing money from them." Then, they think as they make 50k and pay 35% taxed, they can do so too. Long story short, it does not work as long as they do not move away form the EU.
Then, there are the people like OP, which are long gong and live in airports, hotels and the like. In this case, the question actually does make sense, up to a certain extent. I personally would recommend him SG or GG, it will cost about 5k per year.
And finally, there are those mentioned earlier that have substantial income and the possibilities to play the rule by the game. They hire 2 guys somewhere and have substance. This certainly works for now, I suspect that there soon will be a company on Taobao offering such substance as a service and soon, the rules will change again. Also, the corrput governments have too many corrupt and lazy officials that are never personally liable for their lousy work. Hence, their laws are full of loopholes. Of course, the governments are in need to fill some covid spending debts and are now looking for an easier way to get money than by covering loopholes. Hence, they introduced the tax evasion laws where any structure to avoid tax is per se subject to the avoided tax, even if legal. Of course, this also does not change much as all it does it increase the lawyers fees as they have to find excuses for the structure in order to qualify as legitimate.
OP checkout, if you need help or want to discuss PM me
https://www.offshorecorptalk.com/threads/you-need-a-real-address-and-director-for-a-uk-ltd.43463/
https://www.offshorecorptalk.com/threads/you-need-a-real-address-and-director-for-a-uk-ltd.43463/
And what about yor residency, won't you get taxed personally from all profits with such a setup ?
Great , thanks for that !Those are increasingly outmoded requirements. If you keep holding on to the past, the present won't wait for you, and then the future will hit you like a bag of bricks to the face.
Don't start a business if you can't afford accounting or other basic things.
It costs very little and it can help you in many ways (banking, PSPs, taxes). What are you doing running a business if you can't even budget some basic paperwork to be done for it?
I can understand pushing back against audits, but just pure, simple, basic accounting...
Raise money if you need to in order to meet your business needs. Friends and family. Bank loans. Angel investors. Seed investors. VC/PE. You have the drive — go out and find them. OPM is great. Just pay them back and give them value.
Don't start a foreign company if you can't afford to meet substance requirements.
Very few jurisdictions haven't implemented substance requirements yet (for example Samoa), but they are a dying breed. OECD comes for all.
The degree of substance requirements vary but don't look at the relaxed requirement in jurisdiction X today and expect them to stay that way. Be smart. Look at what's going on and deduce what the next move is going to be. Prepare for that. Monitor the situation.
Don't commit tax fraud/tax evasion.
This includes VAT fraud in EU/EEA/UK.
Without a doubt the dumbest crimes you can commit, because the burden of proof is often reversed. You'll probably end up paying the tax you should have, and more in penalties and loss of opportunities.
This brings us to...
Residence is key.
If you don't like the taxes where you live, don't live there. I swear there is pure tax-brain-rot in the Spanish tap water.
Go live somewhere else. The world is big and you can find different tax incentives all over the world.
The Perpetual Traveller dream is just that: a dream. I can't deny there are people out there who do it. But it's getting harder. More and more are opting for genuine, bonafide tax residence somewhere.
Be OK with paying more than zero tax.
It's possible (see 0% tax for digital nomad achievable?), but to a lot of people, simply paying less tax leads to a better quality of life than striving for zero tax.
Paying even just a modicum of tax gives an air of legitimacy that can helpful.
Banking secrecy is dead.
Banking secrecy is gone. You can run around the world chasing non-CRS territories but they are running out, and the last ones standing are going to be places you probably don't want to put your money anyway.
Establish your residence and business in such a way that secrecy is a non-issue.
Corporate secrecy is dying.
Forget anonymity. Instead, understand what is public, what is limited, and what is private.
Public = anyone can view.
Limited = some information is public, some is limited (to law enforcement, to media with good cause, to government).
Private = only you and the government know.
Consider that data leaks, both from service providers/lawyers and from corporate registers themselves.
Use nominees cleverly and carefully.
Asset protection is alive.
Don't buy off-the-shelf solutions. Get something bespoke, set up with the help of people who understand all applicable laws and risks. Don't google "cheap cook islands trust fast instant setup i'm being sued". Plan ahead. Understand your risks. Be realistic.
Good asset protection usually doesn't rely on secrecy (see previous two points).
Pay peanuts, get monkeys.
There are times in life when monkeys are great. They can be great companions at your jungle villa in Costa Rica or fun to encounter in the wild or just walking around Gibraltar or Singapore.
What they are not good for is setting up companies, opening bank accounts, and tax planning.
Just like you don't sell your own time and skills for cheap, neither should you expect others to. Experience costs.
Don't get ripped off, though. Perform due diligence on service providers. And explain your scope to them clearly. Even a good, trustworthy lawyer can go above and beyond racking up billable hours if you don't tell them exactly what to do (ideally agree on pricing in advance).
Paralysis by analysis.
I see so many OCT users fall for this.
Are you entrepreneurs or wannapreneurs?
Asking questions, doing research, and analysing options are good things that you should be doing.
But too often I see people get stuck in hypotheticals and — by the looks of it — getting nowhere, instead worrying about to cash out their 6 trillion USD in crypto using their Cambodian passport while residing in Paraguay. In reality, the business is either non-existent or just puttering by.
Grow your business.
This is probably the most important part. If you have a business that's doing well, focus on growing it if you can continue to scale it up.
Don't take your 500,000 USD/year business offshore just to save on taxes. You probably can't save on taxes (legally) and even if you do, I'd bet the costs of doing so aren't that much different from the costs of paying tax.
Instead, grow your business. Get it big enough that going international starts making sense, factoring in all the costs and complexities thereof.
KYC: Banks are banks are banks.
View attachment 5980
— Look at all those ducks and what a nice row they form! #inspirational
This comes back to basic accounting. Companies with basic accounting don't struggle with showing invoices and agreements when banks ask.
If you want to use fiat money, you have to play by the fiat money rules. This means SOF (Source of Funds) and SOW (Source of Wealth) checks and disclosure.
Keep all statements, invoices, agreements, receipts. Maintain fresh bank statements and utility bills/proof of address. File your taxes. Keep copies of the returns. Store it all safely and redundantly.
Things are tough already and will only get tougher. Be prepared for that.
The End
Panama doesn't tax foreign sourced income and, at least for now, doesn't care about you managing the LLC from Panama.
So it would be possible to hide your assets there as long as you don't do any real crime?
So if I read you right, I would want to open a company in Panama and get my income there which is from all over the world but not Panama.
I don't need to live there while I will have people to manage the company hence substance.
did I understand it all correct?
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