Seeking opinions / Reduce 500 ke inheritance tax

[ikan]

Hi all,
Looking for legal steps to avoid or reduce 500 Keuros inheritance tax in western EU.
Me and my 85 years old mother still in good shape (both eu citizen and tax resident) are closing down our professional real estate company.
We are 'happy' to pay on first step 1.000.000 euros taxes (2 layers of taxes) within the company accountings to the tax authority.
••• LoL •••
My mother is already dying learning tax athority will claim to her son one new extra +- 500ke once she's passed away.
Both of us have very low yearly incomes (< 15ke & < 40ke).
After paying a life of taxes, and beeing now screw up over 85% by taxes on closure of the company and prospective inheritance tax.
Is there any legal ways with relocation of the assets out of EU, completed with new tax residency and/or 2nd citizenship ?
Ortherwise any border line or grey strategy ?
How diffidult to transfer 400/600 ke from EU bank to another juridiction out of EU ? What will be the Eu bank restrictions for thoses figures.
Of course you did well understand : all funds 100% tax cleared & legal.
Thank's to all for any of your inputs, or strategy, or vision.
Sarcasm and idiocies are ••• welcome •••

 

[Nomado]

What about your mother investing in a property abroad and putting your name on it?

 

[DeepDrilling]

Why LoL and what is Ke ?

In which country do you live ?

 

[lili247]

ke = k€

 

[daniels27]

Why LoL and what is Ke ?

Kenia. He is just not very good at using a keyboard. 15ke means 15,000 EUR.

In which country do you live ?

Yes, that is the main question. Also, what are the assets? Because companies and real estate is a bit hard to move.

 

[DeepDrilling]

15K (KILO) means 15,000 EUR - I have never seen KE as an abbreviation for thousand!
Never mind, let's see where he comes from if he doesn't mind telling us.

 

[daniels27]

15K (KILO) means 15,000 EUR - I have never seen KE as an abbreviation for thousand!
Never mind, let's see where he comes from if he doesn't mind telling us.

He means 15ke = 15 KILO EURO. It is really dump abbreviation. Why not spend 1 second more on your keyboard to get useful answers?

 

[DeepDrilling]

He means 15ke = 15 KILO EURO. It is really dump abbreviation. Why not spend 1 second more on your keyboard to get useful answers?

You're the keyboard hero on OCT as far as I can see.

You answered a question I asked OP, and since your answer wasn't correct, I corrected it, now you're just repeating what I already said.

But yeah, a good response from OP would be useful in this thread.

 

[daniels27]

You're the keyboard hero on OCT as far as I can see.

Yes, you can see that here:
https://www.offshorecorptalk.com/members/daniels27.34372/#about
New awards came out yesterday

You answered a question I asked OP, and since your answer wasn't correct, I corrected it, now you're just repeating what I already said.

Not only me:

L

Post in thread 'Seeking opinions / Reduce 500 ke inheritance tax'

Jan 19, 2025

ke = k€

• lili247

But not sure what is not correct. k = kilo, e = euro as @lili247 mentioned.

@deepdriling why attacking me? This is a discussion about facts. Have I ever attacked you here?

 

[providenceventurer]

Hi all,
Looking for legal steps to avoid or reduce 500 Keuros inheritance tax in western EU.
Me and my 85 years old mother still in good shape (both eu citizen and tax resident) are closing down our professional real estate company.
We are 'happy' to pay on first step 1.000.000 euros taxes (2 layers of taxes) within the company accountings to the tax authority.
••• LoL •••
My mother is already dying learning tax athority will claim to her son one new extra +- 500ke once she's passed away.
Both of us have very low yearly incomes (< 15ke & < 40ke).
After paying a life of taxes, and beeing now screw up over 85% by taxes on closure of the company and prospective inheritance tax.
Is there any legal ways with relocation of the assets out of EU, completed with new tax residency and/or 2nd citizenship ?
Ortherwise any border line or grey strategy ?
How diffidult to transfer 400/600 ke from EU bank to another juridiction out of EU ? What will be the Eu bank restrictions for thoses figures.
Of course you did well understand : all funds 100% tax cleared & legal.
Thank's to all for any of your inputs, or strategy, or vision.
Sarcasm and idiocies are ••• welcome •••

If you are closing down why are you not sucking out all the profits from the company first and then closing.Why the hell would you pay a million in taxes are you crazy.There are much better solutions than that.It seems you have a lot of money to waste.Buy some paintings worth a few million dollars first which are erstwhile not pricey from such a service provider and go for some Accounting consulting services who for a charge pay you back,then let the service providers pay you back that amount in crypto.After that you keep your mouth shut for the rest of your life.

 

[daniels27]

If you are closing down why are you not sucking out all the profits from the company first and then closing.Why the hell would you pay a million in taxes are you crazy.There are much better solutions than that.It seems you have a lot of money to waste.Buy some paintings worth a few million dollars first which are erstwhile not pricey from such a service provider and go for some Accounting consulting services who for a charge pay you back,then let the service providers pay you back that amount in crypto.After that you keep your mouth shut for the rest of your life.

Closing down? Passing away? Flying to heaven? Starving in the tax hell. All a bit similar.

But I think he may not close down. Just his mother. If course, she can pull you crypto fraud. But maybe, there is a better way. Depends on the assets. He can also go playing in casino with her. He wins, she loses. Just bad luck and at the end of the night the money had been inherited.

 

[providenceventurer]

Closing down? Passing away? Flying to heaven? Starving in the tax hell. All a bit similar.

But I think he may not close down. Just his mother. If course, she can pull you crypto fraud. But maybe, there is a better way. Depends on the assets. He can also go playing in casino with her. He wins, she loses. Just bad luck and at the end of the night the money had been inherited.

I was thinking of adding this into our other discussion as an example where this crypto payback can be played ,i dont know how to add one discussion into another one here @daniels27 can you help connect both threads.Because they are closing the business anyway they can try what i said.Yes losing in gambling and winning also will work why not put the entire business at stake while gambling .There are no taxes on gambling winnings isnt it in the UK but whether it will hold up in court aka suites or not i dont know.They might be better of using my idea looking at her age.

 

[daniels27]

I was thinking of adding this into our other discussion as an example where this can be done i dont know how to add one discussion into another one here .Because they are closing the business anyway.Yes losing in gambling and winning also will work why not put the entire business at stake while gambling .There are no taxes on gambling winnings isnt it in the UK.It is even better than what i suggested.

Haha. You could also trade NFTs or some shitcoin with you son.

 

[ikan]

Thank's all for your kind attention about my keyboard.
He's working realy fine on sundays... Most likely my brain is wrong on sundays ?

100 ke = 100.000 euros
or ke = k€

What about your mother investing in a property abroad and putting your name on it?

Yes Nomado great input. Thank's for that.
I still enjoy real estate. That is my field.
I need to dig it deeper.
But I'm not 100 % sure how to set it up to do it 100% safe regarding my tax authority.
Or what is wiser : inversting on personal name or trought the layer of an offshore company, or local company of the new property juridiction.
let's write inveting into property in Indonesia, eventualy Thailand, possibly Nicaragua.
My country is taxing me worldwide on my real estate properties assets ! => I pay wealthy tax on propeties.

In which country do you live ?

French Riviera.
Thank's DeepDrilling for asking.

Yes, that is the main question. Also, what are the assets? Because companies and real estate is a bit hard to move.

Thank's Daniel27 for your question.
The company is selling all the incoporated real estates.
Company should be 100% cash assets within year 2025.
Positive remaining balance after taxes will go to the share holders by paying dividends, latest payments by first semester 2026.
Than I will volontary dissovle the company all taxes cleared.
Total assests will be 100% cash after taxes & should be around 1.300.000 euros.
Me and my mothers holds other cash and real estates assets on personal names.

=> Gambling in Casino.
Interesting input Daniels27.
Worth to dig out.
I have not much experience in that field. but some reluctancies about risks.
Many Casino are very close to me, including Monaco.
Not beeing a regular and heavy player in one of those on the French Riviera, will automatically end with a report to the Financial authority for dodgy or unsual transactions ( I explain : swaping in hands 200.000 euros of casino chip/ token in between my mother and I, then cashing out at the cashier front desk will be most likely be Red Flag for the Casino => must report including our ID !).
I used to have a friend : she was the head of a local casino cashier. It is clear they overview transactions, customers and unsual transactions. They want to keep their gambling licence prior to shady customers, or suspicious transactions.

If you are closing down why are you not sucking out all the profits from the company first and then closing.Why the hell would you pay a million in taxes are you crazy.There are much better solutions than that.It seems you have a lot of money to waste.Buy some paintings worth a few million dollars first which are erstwhile not pricey from such a service provider and go for some Accounting consulting services who for a charge pay you back,then let the service providers pay you back that amount in crypto.After that you keep your mouth shut for the rest of your life.

I have no choices. Our companie sale real estate properties with a gain. We must pay 25 % tax on profit/benefits/or sale price. Remaining balance after tax will asume another 30% flat tax on dividends paid to the share holders.
I wrote above : we are both low yearly income => in fact we have no money to waste. Taxes suck us.
The result of closing down / dissolving the compnay = 40 years of work duties, obligations to maitain properties/ investments / risk managments / tenants neglignece / court cases against tenants / tax issues & intrustions / tax bills...

Thank a lot Providenceventurer for your input.
Our company have no mean or legal field of activity to buy and sale painting. The professional accountant of our company will very quickly report us to : 1) financial authority for shady practices and inapropriate funds movments not connected to our field activity 2) to the tax authority to protect himself. 3) he will stop his accounting service very suddenly 4) he will report us to his national council of accountants. ••••• all very fun ••••

Any new inputs welcome
Inputs and insights on properties abroad welcome.

Sarcasm or writting us "we are dumb" ... you are welcome

 

[daniels27]

Sarcasm or writting us "we are dumb" ... you are welcome

Your mother can move to Switzerland. You then pay 115% of taxes. That means you pay more than you get.
https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/business/france-and-switzerland-play-hot-potato-over-taxes/48576434

The best would be to send your mother to a country that does not tax inheritance while you follow her. Some Swiss cantons. You then only pay tax on real estate in France.

But as far as I know, French people normally buy real estate in the name of a company (SCI Societé Civile Immobilière) which can be transferred cheaper.

https://www.investorsinproperty.com/buyers-info/france/what-taxes-will-be-paid-on-death
Also, France offers more opportunities for reducing tax. Inheritance Tax can be reduced or completely avoided by buying in the name of a company (SCI).

Check this one in French
https://www.captaincontrat.com/creer-son-entreprise/sci/sci-succession

 

[daniels27]

Our company have no mean or legal field of activity to buy and sale painting. The professional accountant of our company will very quickly report us to

Your instinct is very good. Even better would be not too use any accountants and do it yourself.

Not beeing a regular and heavy player in one of those on the French Riviera, will automatically end with a report to the Financial authority for dodgy or unsual transactions

Your instinct is very good again. I wold recommend Macau. But I did not know that you are from France. I think you do have a 12% tax on such winnings.

 

[providenceventurer]

Your instinct is very good. Even better would be not too use any accountants and do it yourself.


Your instinct is very good again. I wold recommend Macau. But I did not know that you are from France. I think you do have a 12% tax on such winnings.

Thank's all for your kind attention about my keyboard.
He's working realy fine on sundays... Most likely my brain is wrong on sundays ?

100 ke = 100.000 euros
or ke = k€




Yes Nomado great input. Thank's for that.
I still enjoy real estate. That is my field.
I need to dig it deeper.
But I'm not 100 % sure how to set it up to do it 100% safe regarding my tax authority.
Or what is wiser : inversting on personal name or trought the layer of an offshore company, or local company of the new property juridiction.
let's write inveting into property in Indonesia, eventualy Thailand, possibly Nicaragua.
My country is taxing me worldwide on my real estate properties assets ! => I pay wealthy tax on propeties.


French Riviera.
Thank's DeepDrilling for asking.


Thank's Daniel27 for your question.
The company is selling all the incoporated real estates.
Company should be 100% cash assets within year 2025.
Positive remaining balance after taxes will go to the share holders by paying dividends, latest payments by first semester 2026.
Than I will volontary dissovle the company all taxes cleared.
Total assests will be 100% cash after taxes & should be around 1.300.000 euros.
Me and my mothers holds other cash and real estates assets on personal names.

=> Gambling in Casino.
Interesting input Daniels27.
Worth to dig out.
I have not much experience in that field. but some reluctancies about risks.
Many Casino are very close to me, including Monaco.
Not beeing a regular and heavy player in one of those on the French Riviera, will automatically end with a report to the Financial authority for dodgy or unsual transactions ( I explain : swaping in hands 200.000 euros of casino chip/ token in between my mother and I, then cashing out at the cashier front desk will be most likely be Red Flag for the Casino => must report including our ID !).
I used to have a friend : she was the head of a local casino cashier. It is clear they overview transactions, customers and unsual transactions. They want to keep their gambling licence prior to shady customers, or suspicious transactions.



I have no choices. Our companie sale real estate properties with a gain. We must pay 25 % tax on profit/benefits/or sale price. Remaining balance after tax will asume another 30% flat tax on dividends paid to the share holders.
I wrote above : we are both low yearly income => in fact we have no money to waste. Taxes suck us.
The result of closing down / dissolving the compnay = 40 years of work duties, obligations to maitain properties/ investments / risk managments / tenants neglignece / court cases against tenants / tax issues & intrustions / tax bills...

Thank a lot Providenceventurer for your input.
Our company have no mean or legal field of activity to buy and sale painting. The professional accountant of our company will very quickly report us to : 1) financial authority for shady practices and inapropriate funds movments not connected to our field activity 2) to the tax authority to protect himself. 3) he will stop his accounting service very suddenly 4) he will report us to his national council of accountants. ••••• all very fun ••••

Any new inputs welcome
Inputs and insights on properties abroad welcome.

Sarcasm or writting us "we are dumb" ... you are welcome

Hello thanks for your reply,i want to know if you are selling real estate then how is selling it semi furnished not possible( semi furnished includes the paintings part).If you work with a provider that sells you paintings from the far east on Chinese culture paintings of the 16 th century (shipped from Hongkong) can your accountant say something about it- since when did adding value in your business become a problem .Apart from paintings you can also think of real estate accessories like gold plated bathroom sink etc at high prices etc.
For the last remaining 1 year why dont you fire your accountant first also mentioned by @daniels27 and then do all the things yourself ( buying paintings at a high price)using also the accounting services as mentioned.
I absolutely do not think you are dumb,i am just against losing money.
Again 25% taxes are on profits so buy the expensive painting to add value to your real estate before selling, make a loss and suck out capital.There is nothing anyone( read taxman) can do when a business owner makes dumb decisions in his business and incurs losses.

 

[happyjohn]

OP did you already paid tax from all income, so the only thing is the sale of the business now where you want to pay less taxes possible ?

 

[daniels27]

OP did you already paid tax from all income, so the only thing is the sale of the business now where you want to pay less taxes possible ?

I think he wants to avoid inheritance tax

 

[daniels27]

Hello thanks for your reply,i want to know if you are selling real estate then how is selling it semi furnished not possible( semi furnished includes the paintings part).If you work with a provider that sells you paintings from the far east on Chinese culture paintings of the 16 th century (shipped from Hongkong) can your accountant say something about it- since when did adding value in your business become a problem .Apart from paintings you can also think of real estate accessories like gold plated bathroom sink etc at high prices etc.
For the last remaining 1 year why dont you fire your accountant first also mentioned by @daniels27 and then do all the things yourself ( buying paintings at a high price)using also the accounting services as mentioned.
I absolutely do not think you are dumb,i am just against losing money.
Again 25% taxes are on profits so buy the expensive painting to add value to your real estate before selling, make a loss and suck out capital.There is nothing anyone( read taxman) can do when a business owner makes dumb decisions in his business and incurs losses.

If you buy assets, they will be treated like assets. In other words, thirst paintings wing lower your wealth as they will appear in you book keeping. Further this route. Also if you furnish apartments for 500ke and don't rent them out, the process of furnishing is not part of the business and deductions won't be given.