Looking for someone to consult me on the best way to cash out Crypto with minimal tax.

[Martin Everson]

I prefer not to tell.

It is important to know the precise country as tax authorities are not created equal. Sudan or India tax man is not comparable to Germany or United Kingdom for example. A DTA has nothing to do with tax enforcement or how a country will respond to such a common fake offshore invoicing scheme.

@Admin This is suspicious on the back of the banned member

 

[gonharpia22]

This way I can get a residency in any UAE dtt country, for example the Netherlands which has up to 50% tax and using your scheme to cash out crypto paying 0 or 5%. Too good to bee true.

Income from renting out immovable property / permanent establishment in the UAE is taxed ONLY in the UAE according to every double tax treaty they have signed. That is the whole point. You don't even have to pay 5%. You just do the same for your family members and cash out per 90k/ family member / year.

 

[Martin Everson]

@Admin My spiderman senses tell me that gonharpia22 is the same person as banned member totlori9 .

Something is not adding up. I hope I am wrong and no offense to gonharpia22 intended if you are not the same person . Showing a taxman a fake invoice is suicide. That is way more dangerous than the 99% of customers who show Europacific Bank for example fake invoices. EPB can just close or freeze your account at best. The government is a whole different game.

One can cash out crypto far easier I think.

 

[gonharpia22]

It is important to know the precise country as tax authorities are not created equal. Sudan or India tax man is not comparable to Germany or United Kingdom for example. A DTA has nothing to do with tax enforcement or how a country will respond to such a common fake offshore invoicing scheme.

@Admin This is suspicious on the back of the banned member

It is not important as DTAs have to be respected by the tax authorities of the countries they have been signed by.

Just because you have asked it 4 times in a pushy way doesn't make it any more important to the topic.

If the DTA declares income from renting immovable property / permanent establishment located in the UAE being subject to tax only in the UAE, than it doesn't matter if you are located in Soudan or India or Germany or the UK the local tax authority still can't tax it. Not even if the information was first posted by a banned member you had a beef with. Even if you so preferred.

You have arrived claiming what I said was nonesense and stupid without being able to simply read what I have written, just because the idea originated from a member you hate.

I have done what you advised the OP in the third post of this thread. Went and talked to a local advisor firm (one accountant and one tax attorney to be exact). Now that they have confirmed what the guy you hate has stated you switched to bullying. I absolutely don't understand what you'd like to gain from this, nor do I care anymore...

 

[Martin Everson]

It is not important as DTAs have to be respected by the tax authorities of the countries they have been signed by.

A government does not have to respect a fake invoice. DTA has nothing to do with investigating the source of funds. You must never have dealt with this stuff before.

have done what you advised the OP in the third post of this thread. Went and talked to a local advisor firm (one accountant and one tax attorney to be exact).

So your information is not useful to anyone as you are giving generic advice. People hope to get workable solutions. Not generic hearsay that you dont intend to prove.

We can all make claims but please back them up.

 

[gonharpia22]

@Admin My spiderman senses tell me that gonharpia22 is the same person as banned member totlori9 .

Something is not adding up. I hope I am wrong and no offense to gonharpia22 intended if you are not the same person . Showing a taxman a fake invoice is suicide. That is way more dangerous than the 99% of customers who show Europacific Bank for example fake invoices. EPB can just close or freeze your account at best. The government is a whole different game.

One can cash out crypto far easier I think.

Now I understand! You just really don't know what you are talking about. Nobody has said anything about any invoices. Invoices have to be made out if one of the parties are VAT registered. Here one of the parties is a private person below the VAT threshold, the other party is an offshore company not subject to VAT. Also showing the taxman a fake invoice with an offshore company trying to prove a fake expense is suicide. Showing the taxman a contract proving income received from renting property in another country has nothing to do with that.

I am also not the previously banned member totlori9.

I also preferred to only talk about on topic from now on.

 

[gonharpia22]

You must never have dealt with this stuff before.

See my post above how an invoice is still not necessary in this scenario as there are no VAT registered parties in the contract.

So your information is not useful to anyone as you are giving generic advice. People hope to get workable solutions. Not generic hearsay that you dont intend to prove.

We can all make claims but please back them up.

Where is your residence? Look up your countries DTA with the UAE. Look up immovable property. I'll wait.

 

[Martin Everson]

When you cash out crypto you receive your funds from a crypto exchange to your bank account in your name. Should the tax authority/bank ask for the source of funds you provide two contracts

You think here for example that the taxman will blindly accept your fake invoice. Under a DTA they can request your bank account record and information pertaining to the transaction from the other country....please read it carefully. The taxman does not take your word or fake documents for granted in many cases. Otherwise there would not be a genuine invoice in existence. We really need to know if the country you are resident in has a competent tax authority.

Where is your residence?

I am a Bahamian

Look up your countries DTA with the UAE. Look up immovable property. I'll wait.

There is no DTA for UAE with Bahamas . As I keep saying DTA has nothing to do with fake invoices.

 

[gonharpia22]

You think here for example that the taxman will blindly accept your fake invoice. Under a DTA they can request your bank account record and information pertaining to the transaction from the other country....please read it carefully. The taxman does not take your word or fake documents for granted in many cases. Otherwise there would not be a genuine invoice in existence. We really need to know if the country you are resident in has a competent tax authority.



I am a Bahamian



There is no DTA for UAE with Bahamas . As I keep saying DTA has nothing to do with fake invoices.

Martin you DO keep saying invoices. Of which there is still none involved in this transaction.

Also there is no bank account in the other country.

Do you even understand anything about this concept?

 

[Martin Everson]

Look here is one solution for anyone thinking of cashing out BTC the proper way. Just do the following:

1. Move to territorial tax country in EU
2. Open an account with Bunq
3. Go to Bitcoins kopen en verkopen via iDEAL en Bancontact bij de nummer 1 van Nederland!
4. Place your sell order and account details

You only need to verify your Bunq account or any SEPA account and then you will be left alone -they bank with Bunq btw .

Don't waste your time with scammers or elaborate nonsense. Only problem is that of past capital gains but then that is between you and your conscience .

 

[gonharpia22]

Look here is one solution for anyone thinking of cashing out BTC the proper way. Just do the following:

1. Move to territorial tax country in EU
2. Open an account with Bunq
3. Go to Bitcoins kopen en verkopen via iDEAL en Bancontact bij de nummer 1 van Nederland!
4. Place your sell order and account details

You only need to verify your Bunq account or any SEPA account and then you will be left alone -they bank with Bunq btw .

Don't waste your time with scammers or elaborate nonsense. Only problem is that of past capital gains but then that is between you and your conscience .

For anyone else that does understand that there are no invoices involved with the previous method, you actually don't have to move anywhere...

 

[7889]

Look here is one solution for anyone thinking of cashing out BTC the proper way. Just do the following:

1. Move to territorial tax country in EU
.

Strictly speaking, afaik there's only one such country in EU, and that is Monaco. Then again, why move at all...

 

[GrumpyMess]

Strictly speaking, afaik there's only one such country in EU, and that is Monaco. Then again, why move at all...

Monaco is not the part of EU and you have to show 500k euro and the source of these funds together with not a cheap apartment rent

 

[Martin Everson]

Strictly speaking, afaik there's only one such country in EU, and that is Monaco. Then again, why move at all...

There are at least half a dozen territorial tax countries in EU. I gave a partial list in thread below.

Residency in Malta + offshore company

Oh and Monaco is definitely not part of EU as mentioned. Plus 500k may be minimum on paper but in reality you will be at the back of the queue behind people of Lewis Hamilton's wealth with private jets or some Gulf State royalty with $1bn in lose change .

 

[GrumpyMess]

There are at least half a dozen territorial tax countries in EU. I gave a partial list in thread below.

Is this a list proven in practice? As far as I studied no one country within EU will allow you to cash out your crypto or dividends from offshore company tax free

but in reality you will be at the back of the queue behind people of Lewis Hamilton's wealth with private jets or some Gulf State royalty with $1bn in lose change .

There is no indication anywhere that they do have limit on issued residence permits. Just strict AML policy and interview.

 

[gonharpia22]

I have just received confirmation from the UAE storage room renting company that they received my payment and the UAE address in my name is alive from now on.

I have decided to send a letter to the mailing address later today (which is my name and a PO box type number in Dubai - I was allowed to choose from a few other locations Abud Dhabi, etc.) to see if it gets bounced or it gets delivered in order...

Once this is done, I am going to do a cashout with a test amount (lets say €3000) before dec 31 (that is still in this tax year) so that I'll see how the tax authority of the country of my residence reacts to the transaction. I think this is the smart thing to do, and everyone should do the same when trying something new.

(
notes for Martin:
- no there were no invoices,
- yes, everyone here already knows you hate the user the idea first originated from, please stop telling everyone
- no, I'm still not the same person
- yes, I do already know you don't like the visuals of the website I just linked, but it's still not an advisory firm, just someone renting out storage rooms for expats
- no, some of us won't want to move our residence anywhere, even if you already did and that is the only solution you'll ever believe in
- yes, I do understand that this solution doesn't even work for you, because you live in a country with no double tax treaty with the UAE, I'm sorry for that but it is really not my fault, please don't punish me for it
- yes, I once again - really - promise there were no invoices involved in this transaction, nor will they be, so please don't post anymore about how fake invoices are not accepted as expenses by tax authorities as it is still irrelevant information to this subject, and as you put it:

your information is not useful to anyone as you are giving generic advice. People hope to get workable solutions. Not generic hearsay that you dont intend to prove.

- so please do as you advise others to do, while I am testdriving the 'workable solution'.
)

 

[Martin Everson]

Is this a list proven in practice? As far as I studied no one country within EU will allow you to cash out your crypto or dividends from offshore company tax free

Yes it is. All remittance based tax systems are not created equal. For example in Malta if you remit foreign income (that is income not already taxed by a DTA country) as a non-Maltese under their territorial tax system you are taxed on it. If you remit capital gains you are not taxed . It is different in UK, Ireland etc etc. You need knowledge of what you are doing and to make sure obtain an advanced ruling from taxman via your accountant if in doubt .

There is no indication anywhere that they do have limit on issued residence permits. Just strict AML policy and interview.

No one mentioned limits so I am confused by why you say this.

 

[Martin Everson]

The website I used to obtain it (as I promised to the Admin yesterday) is >>snipped<<:

Lol at that cheap scam website you setup with no address or details and just a [email protected] address to contact. Does your taxman have dark glasses and a cane by any chance? Is this what you expect the taxman to believe? . You can't make this scam up that your promoting. This is helpful to no one...lol.

- yes, I do already know you don't like the visuals of the website I just linked, but it's still not an advisory firm, just someone renting out storage rooms for expats

You trying to head off the obvious criticism you know is coming. I am sorry if I upset your plans but BS can't be allowed.

@Admin My spiderman senses are correct this is a scammer. This person must be totlori9 for sure. This SCAMMER is going to cause members to lose money with this scam .

 

[KJK]

Don't waste your time with scammers or elaborate nonsense. Only problem is that of past capital gains but then that is between you and your conscience .

1) What exactly are past capital gains?

_________________________
2) I think this thread really diverted into something strange or I may be missing something.
I do not get the entire point of what that, now banned, guy described here - getting some warehouse rental abroad? Then issue fake invoices? I do not get the point, maybe I am stupid but please explain.

Okay, he made some money in crypto (as a private person?) and now wants to cash out. Why get a company and create fake invoices for it, specifically below VAT limit. This sounds like something uselessly complicated that even does not help AT ALL in that situation. Maybe making situation worse than it was before.

What really matters is your nationality and your residency. Or am I completely wrong?

 

[Martin Everson]

1) What exactly are past capital gains?

The unrealized gains you made while resident in the other country.

Hypothetical example:

You are resident in Country A in 2017 and bought 100 bitcoins at $1000 each in Feb 2017 while resident in Country A. At end of tax year Bitcoin was at $13,500 each. You held Bitcoin and moved to tax free Country B and sold your crypto at $17,000 each. You are still liable for to pay the capital gains tax to Country A . Moving does not remove that obligation.

So if you paid in total $100,000 for the crypto in 2017 your crypto was worth in 2017 when you left Country A $1,350,000. However you sold at $17,000 making you $1,700,000. Your past unrealized gains while living in Country A you need to pay capital gains tax to Country A on those past gains i.e tax on a gain of $1,250,000 . The gain from $1,250,000 to $1,700,000 is the only amount that is tax free in Country B....lol.

99% of people will not have declared the crypto to Country A before they left However if the taxman does manage to find out by mistake...i.e CRS reporting error to Country A be ready to prove the source of funds and when you acquired them to Country A.

I do not get the entire point of what that, now banned, guy described here - getting some warehouse rental abroad?

He was making no point he was trying to scam people with his nonsense, just like this guy that posted that joke storage website...lol.

We diverge