Question Liechtenstein private banking

[JohnnyDoe]

Can you share that "trick" in DM ?
Can I DM you?

Sure, but I already gave hints in other posts

 

[Forester]

If you have dispute some place in EU (for example your EU nationality country).
In EU your funds can be easily frozen for some wife/business partner dispute and the court decision is enforceable in all Lugano Convention countries.
So, let's say if you keep assets in Liechtenstein, they cannot be frozen without going to courts in Liechtenstein. Good luck to person trying coming to Liechtenstein to take someones property.
All Liechtenstein country is based on protecting assets, privacy and etc. In EU countries there are crazy laws and assets can be frozen easily
Also it would be way more expensive for someone to try false court claim in Liechtenstein than local EU country were they can get "state" attorney

Oh yes. Now I understand what you mean – and I agree with you at this point.
(Remark: To make a judgement really enforceable abroad is IMO still not quite simple even between the countries engaged in Lugano Convention; but it is not the core.)

A bit unrelated, but is Liechtenstein better when it comes to safe deposit boxes? SwissGoldSafe for example offers them in both CH and LI so I'm wondering if there's a difference?

See this Question - Liechtenstein private banking post of @Konstanz...

In Liechtenstein like anywhere else you are just a Google search away from having your assets frozen. All what it takes, for example, is a false and defamatory article written by your spouse/competitor/stalker.

Do you have in mind an accusation of money laundering, making a child pornography or similar wrongdoing that would be eagerly processed even by Liechtenstein institutions? (Because otherwise, it is true that it is not so cheap and simple to start a court case in Liechtenstein...)

In what way is being an EEA member a factor in this case?

None, I would say – and I guess that this is what you mean

 

[JohnnyDoe]

Do you have in mind an accusation of money laundering, making a child pornography or similar wrongdoing that would be eagerly processed even by Liechtenstein institutions? (Because otherwise, it is true that it is not so cheap and simple to start a court case in Liechtenstein...)

I’m not talking of a formal accusation, just of a Google search result. All what it takes is someone who writes a defamatory article on you, and the bank will act without the need of a court order.

 

[Forester]

I’m not talking of a formal accusation, just of a Google search result. All what it takes is someone who writes a defamatory article on you, and the bank will act without the need of a court order.

Well... yes, it might happen nowadays, unfortunately. Nevertheless, I still think that such an article should concern something like I have mentioned above, to trigger an action. But – fortunately – I have no personal experience with such an issue, so difficult to judge.

 

[JohnnyDoe]

Well... yes, it might happen nowadays, unfortunately. Nevertheless, I still think that such an article should concern something like I have mentioned above, to trigger an action. But – fortunately – I have no personal experience with such an issue, so difficult to judge.

Remember that money laundering can be attached to just any kind of supposed wrongdoing. In fact, it’s the usual trick used by state authorities to freeze accounts for whatever reason, including tax evasion, which is not a crime in many countries.

Whereas a defamatory article can claim about anything and then it will be up to you to prove it false in a court, which can take months or years. Meanwhile the bank (which might have been alerted - anonymously - by the author of the article) will freeze the account, or, in a best case scenario, close it because of “reputational risk”.

 

[Forester]

Remember that money laundering can be attached to just any kind of supposed wrongdoing. In fact, it’s the usual trick used by state authorities to freeze accounts for whatever reason, including tax evasion, which is not a crime in many countries.

Whereas a defamatory article can claim about anything and then it will be up to you to prove it false in a court, which can take months or years. Meanwhile the bank (which might have been alerted - anonymously - by the author of the article) will freeze the account, or, in a best case scenario, close it because of “reputational risk”.

Horrible. But probably possible, at least in some cases.

 

[Konstanz]

Well... yes, it might happen nowadays, unfortunately. Nevertheless, I still think that such an article should concern something like I have mentioned above, to trigger an action. But – fortunately – I have no personal experience with such an issue, so difficult to judge.

I am not talking about AML, compliance , tax, criminal cases. I am talking about disputes between business partners and similar. When you have civil court decision in Romania enforceable in Germany for example

 

[Forester]

I am not talking about AML, compliance , tax, criminal cases. I am talking about disputes between business partners and similar. When you have civil court decision in Romania enforceable in Germany for example

Yes, of course; I have understand what you meant. Further reaction of mine is to @JohnnyDoe's warning (that is, unfortunately, not just a paranoia...)

 

[Fred]

Dear Member,

Israeli passport holder & tax resident is looking to open private bank account in Lichtenstein to transfer his large savings from his EU / Israeli banks and use its facilities such as credit card etc. Also, potentially for his EU/UK businesses. Would you kindly recommend friendly bank that can facilitate this either online or in person. Many thanks, gentlemen !

From your mentioned needs here the only Bank in Liechtenstein with some Retail Banking Offering means: Current Account, Debit Card an normal Wire Transfer Charges is LLB (Liechtensteinische Landesbank) - they onboard even FZCO with 500.000 EUR in Dubai DIFC Branch so I can imagine for Personal Account it could be even lower.

All the other mentioned banks are Private Banks charging you 100 CHF for a Wire Transfer sometimes even have a Credit Card / Debit Card only some EU Cards /Local Cards like Maestro and want to have at least 350.000 CHF in invested Assets like Bendura - they even have issues with being used for daily transaction purpose.

If it doesn't need to be a Liechtenstein Bank just use Swissquote in Switzerland like already mentioned here.

 

[wheelspin]

Since I am still forced to use banks, I split between several jurisdictions and use a few tricks which I can’t disclose publicly or the forum police will slap me. I am conscious that money in the bank is not my money (like crypto without your keys is not your crypto) and can be taken away in many ways, so I govern myself accordingly.

Who do you bank with, if you don't mind to share?

If it doesn't need to be a Liechtenstein Bank just use Swissquote in Switzerland like already mentioned here.

What would be the purpose of using a private bank like LGT? Do you know if they offer self-directed accounts?

 

[Spinat]

Bendura is the most straightforward. You definitely need to leave some money on the account and invest it with their products, probably 500k-1m min but you can discuss.

Some of you guys are doing serious money!

 

[nobel]

Some of you guys are doing serious money!

The Bendura and all LI bank fees are crazy. Custody fees 0,35%, stock market purchase 1,90% and many other fees! No thanks.

 

[turtle]

The Bendura and all LI bank fees are crazy. Custody fees 0,35%, stock market purchase 1,90% and many other fees! No thanks.

0.35% is not high for PV if you have less than $5M but the transaction fee is extremely high.

 

[JohnnyDoe]

0.35% is not high for PV if you have less than $5M but the transaction fee is extremely high.

But you receive a nice Xmas gift and you are invited to the annual polo event

 

[turtle]

But you receive a nice Xmas gift and you are invited to the annual polo event

Yes sir but after you paid $30K in annual fees.

 

[JohnnyDoe]

Yes sir but after you paid $30K in annual fees.

You get what you pay for. Pay peanuts, get monkeys.

 

[turtle]

You get what you pay for. Pay peanuts, get monkeys.

No need to pay high amounts for private banking if you choose the correct one.

DBS bank is one of the safest banks in the world with a credit rating of AA-. If you have $5M, they can easily offer you a 0.15% custodian and %0.10 transaction fee.

 

[GeneralGogol]

DBS bank is one of the safest banks in the world with a credit rating of AA-. If you have $5M, they can easily offer you a 0.15% custodian and %0.10 transaction fee.

Exactly, which leads you to question what people would pay 1.90% on purchase and 0.35% custody - people with shitty structures from bad jurisdictions that DBS won't touch with a ten foot pole. Ask yourself if you want to be banking in the same bank as these people...

Rule of thumb: If some of the shadier people on this forum say that a bank accepted them, maybe best to avoid that bank

 

[JohnnyDoe]

if you need to save 1% to be happy you have a sad life

 

[turtle]

if you need to save 1% to be happy you have a sad life

Actually it is not only 1%. Think bigger. It is 10% for ten years which means $1M fee for a $10M portfolio