Discover: Estonian crypto company uses swiss bank account

[Ferray]

Hey folks.
Just discovered that nexo .io, crypto loan company registered under Estonian law uses Swiss bank account to accept payments, in particular InCore Bank AG
Does anyone hear anything about InCore Bank AG?

 

[Martin Everson]

A Bulgarian run company offering around a 50% loan to value (LTV) when I look at their Instant Crypto Credit Line. Then they are offering an unsustainable 8% interest on Euro Deposits. Without investigating any further I know all I need to know to not proceed with looking any further.

So what happens if BTC tanks 80% during a year. I mean you would scream and then they would scream then they are out of business right? Their model assumes i.e BTC won't move more than 50% down during a loan period in order that the BTC you gave covers the loan amount. However a sudden sharp movement in BTC and booom

Frankly it is a daft business model to accept volatile crypto as collateral. Even if they tried to sell of the BTC way in advance of a margin call they would drive down the entire crypto market compounding the problem....lol.

 

[Ferray]

Actually the question was about swiss bank opening an account for Estonian company

But if we already talk about their business model - they never "scream", they sell your collateral (or part of it) with something like 15% above your "liquidation" price, thus they never lose their money, customer on other hand can lose part or all holdings if collateral tanks, but this is about customers money management and nothing to do with Nexo business model. They issued over $300mln of loans, so I wouldn't be worried about them. By the way, it is 5.9% per year now, not 8%.
This is not bad solution for those who has to pay taxes on crypto, as with Nexo solution, if you have crypto you dont need to pay taxes and still use money from crypto, but of course it has a price tag of 5,9% per year, which is still usually less from paying taxes on your crypto gains

Going back to swiss bank account for estonian company question - they have a financial license, so this answers the question how they opened an account with swiss bank...

 

[Martin Everson]

they sell your collateral (or part of it) with something like 15% above your "liquidation" price

Won't work in reality. If a crypto flash crash happened there is no circuit breakers on the market like there is on stock exchanges. Placing 15% above liquidation prices assumes solid liquidity in BTC market.

They issued over $300mln of loans, so I wouldn't be worried about them.

That is the reason to be worried . Just means there is a lot of idiots out there.

By the way, it is 5.9% per year now, not 8%.

Sorry your wrong!!!!! 8% is interest offered on the Euro deposit as I stated clearly. 5.9% is loan rate. It is BS to be offering 8% deposit rate as its unsustainable and people are gonna be wiped out worse than buying WeWorks 2025 bond....lol.

 

[Ferray]

Oh, sorry, I made a mistake, don't kill me for that.
Why are you so aggressive?
At the end, It's their business lets leave them alone... otherwise it seems we know something about their business that they don't

 

[Ferray]

All I wanted to know how they managed to open a swiss account for an estonian company

 

[Sols]

It's not a normal bank. Just look at their website. It looks more like a banking-as-a-service or banking platform solution.

 

[Andrew Gooden]

Oh, sorry, I made a mistake, don't kill me for that.
Why are you so aggressive?
At the end, It's their business lets leave them alone... otherwise it seems we know something about their business that they don't

Martin Everson is not being aggressive it just seems that way, furthermore, he just tells it as it is. If I were you I would listen to his input as he is a Financial Walking Encypodelia.

 

[Andrew Gooden]

It's not a normal bank. Just look at their website. It looks more like a banking-as-a-service or banking platform solution.

InCore Bank AG. Incore Bank AG operates as a bank. The Company provides outsourcing services that makes bankers lives easier including, settlement, custody & payments, accounting, compliance & tax support, relationship management, client reporting, internet banking, application and infrastructure service providing.
Founded: 2006
Parent organization: SOBACO Holding AG
Subsidiary: Incore Bank AG, Asset Management Arm

 

[Martin Everson]

why would people take a loan and pay interest and give their own Bitcoins as collateral. Why not sell Bitcoin and use money?

Because they are brainwashed and think Bitcoin will continue to go up in value forever. Hence they don't want to sell an appreciating asset but are happy to take short term fiat loans for their daily activities.

I don't get the business model.

That's because the business model makes no sense. Many of these loan companies during a BTC price crash have to liquidate the bitcoin they are holding as collateral for the loans which drives the price of BTC down further. It's a spiral of death and daft business model full of scam and sham companies with Wirecard levels of accounting transparency.

 

[Ferray]

Haha, its strange to make a statement about business model making no sense because they actually make money from it, at least for now. This, is only 1 billion dollar industry for now, but I believe its going to expend much more in the next year or so.
There are lots of competition with all that DEFI projects...
Of course, there are bad players, as in any industry, not just crypto.

On other hand, taking a loan instead of selling your crypto is a non tax event, and in reality and compared to 90% average gain of bitcoin for the past 10 years, is something worth considering, this is one reason.
Another reason, as you mentioned, they believe that price will go up at some point, so they prefer to pay % and keep their holdings. This way or another, this industry came from nowhere and if you look at defipilse website it shows you how much collateral has been deposited in those defi project (by the way, nexo is a custodial service)
And, of course, this industry has holes,as anything new....