Bulgaria or Cyprus for company and residency?

[Joe Blasco]

I'd just like to add two observations about Cyprus:
- The climate is hot - very hot. This year it was above +32C still in mid-October. For people of e.g. Mediterranean origin, that might be completely OK, but many North Europeans/Scandinavians like this kind of weather only in small doses. Cyprus is like this almost six months/year.
- Cyprus city planning adheres to Anglo-Saxon model, where cities are built for cars, not pedestrians. Outside of very tiny old city quarters in Limassol, Paphos and Larnaca, you can't really walk anywhere. Streets are very wide; traffic is crazy and there's lots of it; parked cars block pavements; public transport options are weak. Most of European cities from West to East are quite walkable - Cyprus just isn't so, except for Nicosia. Many foreigners aren't bothered by this at all, some others are.

In my opinion the cities, lifestyle, climate, food etc. in Cyprus are inferior to what can be arranged in e.g. Spain/Portugal/Canaries. I've lived in Cyprus for 1½ years now, and looking for an exit already.

traffic is crazy because every villager there owns 2-3 different cars, especially a mercedes , to show off how rich he is...

 

[Clip]

In my opinion the cities, lifestyle, climate, food etc. in Cyprus are inferior to what can be arranged in e.g. Spain/Portugal/Canaries. I've lived in Cyprus for 1½ years now, and looking for an exit already.

Canary Islands also have a low tax regime for companies of 5%

 

[georgio]

I aint confusing nothing . Our friend stated he has an EU passport. 99,9 % his tax residency is in the country of his citizenship, if he had some kind of residency and tax residency elsewere, he woudn t ask these questions...

Indeed, currently tax resident in Greece, receiving dividends from UK company. There is a double tax treaty between Greece and UK, as there is with Cyprus, saying that you don't have to pay any difference on tax on dividends, or corporation tax. However, it's in the interpretation of the tax office, to say that your company is run from Greece (my argument is that I have no client there or even contractors, I also don't spend much time in Greece, I'm mostly in western EU countries or in Asia, in fact, last 2 years I didn't spend more than 6 months in any country).

You could have just ended at this point and most people would understand . I 1oo% agree.

I shared my feelings about Bulgaria back in another thread below Sept 2018 when I wrote the below and my feelings have not changed:

Have a nice day.

Indeed, Bulgaria is way behind in developments, but that is not necessarily bad. You can find nice decorated properties for affordable prices, nice affordable spas, restaurants etc. Also there is well-trained stuff if needed for IT.

I'd just like to add two observations about Cyprus:
- The climate is hot - very hot. This year it was above +32C still in mid-October. For people of e.g. Mediterranean origin, that might be completely OK, but many North Europeans/Scandinavians like this kind of weather only in small doses. Cyprus is like this almost six months/year.
- Cyprus city planning adheres to Anglo-Saxon model, where cities are built for cars, not pedestrians. Outside of very tiny old city quarters in Limassol, Paphos and Larnaca, you can't really walk anywhere. Streets are very wide; traffic is crazy and there's lots of it; parked cars block pavements; public transport options are weak. Most of European cities from West to East are quite walkable - Cyprus just isn't so, except for Nicosia. Many foreigners aren't bothered by this at all, some others are.

In my opinion the cities, lifestyle, climate, food etc. in Cyprus are inferior to what can be arranged in e.g. Spain/Portugal/Canaries. I've lived in Cyprus for 1½ years now, and looking for an exit already.

True, you need air condition + car in Cyprus. I neither didn't like much the lifestyle, preferring Spain or Greek islands, more things to do there.

 

[Martin Everson]

You can find nice decorated properties for affordable prices, nice affordable spas, restaurants etc. Also there is well-trained stuff if needed for IT.

That is very true especially the trained IT staff.

It is just a shame I had to abort my plans I had for Bulgaria due to environment.

 

[Joe Blasco]

Indeed, currently tax resident in Greece, receiving dividends from UK company. There is a double tax treaty between Greece and UK, as there is with Cyprus, saying that you don't have to pay any difference on tax on dividends, or corporation tax. However, it's in the interpretation of the tax office, to say that your company is run from Greece (my argument is that I have no client there or even contractors, I also don't spend much time in Greece, I'm mostly in western EU countries or in Asia, in fact, last 2 years I didn't spend more than 6 months in any country).



Indeed, Bulgaria is way behind in developments, but that is not necessarily bad. You can find nice decorated properties for affordable prices, nice affordable spas, restaurants etc. Also there is well-trained stuff if needed for IT.

you meed to fix your residency and tax residency to be 100% foolproof against the tax office. Bulgaria would be a cheaper , easier, more discrete solution. I will disagree on one point though, real estate especially in Sofia is in a very bad state and extremelly invflated prices. You can find something just for the papers, but not something a normal westerner can live. All other places are almost deserted, everybody left for Sofia or abroad.

 

[JohnLocke]

In your oppinion Bulgaria is the better place if you have to find a country to avoid huge taxes and have less complications with the tax office?

This is only compared towards Cyprus or other offshore destinations too i.e. Andorra, Gran Canaria, Switzerland etc. ?

 

[WoWNull]

I shared my feelings about Bulgaria back in another thread below Sept 2018 when I wrote the below and my feelings have not changed:

can you share the link for this post please ^^

 

[Joe Blasco]

hello from the...shithole as some members write. Cyprus accountants and lawyers are full of s**t, bulgarian accountants ate full of s**t too. Difference is that in Cyprus they ask for 3-4 times more than in Bulgaria and even if you confront them will real clues for what is going on and what the tax law really writes, they will stick to their story, because this is what they are really selling, bulls**t...An other thing, If you go to an accountant s office and has this table for board meetings as all in Cyprus do ( and a few in bulgaria) RUN away !!! For all your needs residency, tax residency, house etc in Cyprus they are going to ask for an arm and leg because their bellies are full and one client less they wouldn t care. Language is a barrier in Bulgaria, so it s more convenient for people of russian speaking countries and there are a lot of them here. It is not Monaco nor Andorra , but trust me you are not chained here, when you finish your business you are free to go. Last but not least bulgarians love to hang out , there are a lot of nice cafes, clubs and restaurants .

 

[JohnLocke]

Difference is that in Cyprus they ask for 3-4 times more than in Bulgaria and even if you confront them will real clues

Sorry but I disagree with this statement. I agree with the the first sentence they are full of s**t But it all comes down to who you consult and speak with in Cyprus so in Bulgaria.

 

[Martin Everson]

can you share the link for this post please ^^

https://www.offshorecorptalk.com/threads/getting-the-bulgarian-residency.24176/#post-81196

 

[Joe Blasco]

https://www.offshorecorptalk.com/threads/getting-the-bulgarian-residency.24176/#post-81196

actually I am reading this and hold my bulgarian residency which took me 2 days ( from total zero) Gentlemen we look at something from a different perspective: if you are used to hang around with princess Stefanie of Monaco and have millions to spend do not come in bulgaria. If you like Germany and how everything should be exactly by the book do not come either. On the other hand, if you worked hard for your money in life and you hate throwing around for no usefull purpose, then visit . You will not visit for the beauty of the place, which honestly is not that bad, but to save money. Keep the money you saved and visit Monaco, Bahamas and Andorra as a tourist If you like hanging around with simple people and understand that everybody in life needs some motivation your plans will be succesfull quite easily. I will stop here , saludos revolucionarios !

 

[OTR365]

hello from the...shithole

After traveling extensively for years, I've come to conclusion that all countries are shitholes. ALL OF THEM - except for Spain which isn't a shithole, but agujero de mierda.

The general level of most things in Bulgaria is relatively low. The good news is, prices are even lower. For example, some years ago I paid 450€/month rent +about 50€ for utilities for a 80-90 m2 apartment in Sofia. A quiet but central location, two balconies, a floor with Italian tiles, a great kitchen and good furniture. I haven't been able to find as good price/quality ratio ever since. In Cyprus you would be paying over 1000 €/month for a similar apartment. Perhaps equally good price/quality could be found in some places in Thailand, but that country is infested with tropical insects, lizards and transvestites.

Sofia is good for relatively low income earners, giving a lot of bang for the buck. The Black Sea coast I would not consider for year around living. I suggest people earning >100K (€/$) should consider some other country. Spanish/Italian/French speakers, if they absolutely want to live in the Balkans, could try out Bucharest. It is like Sofia, but prettier. Slavic language speakers have a head start in Bulgaria.

It is too bad that European low tax residence options are so limited. I don't think I could last long in a place like Andorra. It is a shithole with mountain views. Georgia HNWI is an option, but it is a shithole, too. A place like Estonia is an e-Shithole, and not even low tax. Gibraltar? An expensive shithole-on-a-rock.

 

[JohnLocke]

After traveling extensively for years, I've come to conclusion that all countries are shitholes. ALL OF THEM - except for Spain which isn't a shithole, but agujero de mierda.

That's a hell of a conclusion WOW

 

[WoWNull]

After traveling extensively for years, I've come to conclusion that all countries are shitholes. ALL OF THEM - except for Spain which isn't a shithole, but agujero de mierda.

The general level of most things in Bulgaria is relatively low. The good news is, prices are even lower. For example, some years ago I paid 450€/month rent +about 50€ for utilities for a 80-90 m2 apartment in Sofia. A quiet but central location, two balconies, a floor with Italian tiles, a great kitchen and good furniture. I haven't been able to find as good price/quality ratio ever since. In Cyprus you would be paying over 1000 €/month for a similar apartment. Perhaps equally good price/quality could be found in some places in Thailand, but that country is infested with tropical insects, lizards and transvestites.

Sofia is good for relatively low income earners, giving a lot of bang for the buck. The Black Sea coast I would not consider for year around living. I suggest people earning >100K (€/$) should consider some other country. Spanish/Italian/French speakers, if they absolutely want to live in the Balkans, could try out Bucharest. It is like Sofia, but prettier. Slavic language speakers have a head start in Bulgaria.

It is too bad that European low tax residence options are so limited. I don't think I could last long in a place like Andorra. It is a shithole with mountain views. Georgia HNWI is an option, but it is a shithole, too. A place like Estonia is an e-Shithole, and not even low tax. Gibraltar? An expensive shithole-on-a-rock.

Thats why i was think to setup a company first then migrate when i can get around 8 to 10k a month, but the issue a lot of limitations and its require to have a Bulgarian to process the bank accounts etc.. So i decide to have Estonian company then when its time to Migrate will open a branch their and migrate and become as self employed cheap country, nice weather, and good ranked passport .


For Cyprus i heard a lot and i know people living there for cheaper than here in Dubai but again i feel its small and i need to have more natural views, i am fedup with sand for last 27y omg hhhh so good i have people suggest Bulgaria

But just to be honest i have a Bulgarian friend and she tell me straight forward the lawyers and accountant will eat you and rip your money if you don't know anything about the country and don't know the language so id you have someone you can trust that can help you will be much easier

Last time i calculate it with my friend its about 3k for first month to startup the things and make it lunch and next month will be just for living cost which is cheap, btw this price including the migration process and getting the card etc... From what i saw cheapest company setup in Bulgaria while you are outside is around 1.5k or 1.7k which then you need to add Bulgarian to make bank account and again rise to 2.5k =/ so again its much higher than other price, and if u was there lawyers can even double or triple that.

 

[Suzy Emerald]

Consider Romania doing a setup under the micro enterprise regime. Romanian language has quite some resemblance with latin languages too.

 

[speedster]

Thats why i was think to setup a company first then migrate when i can get around 8 to 10k a month, but the issue a lot of limitations and its require to have a Bulgarian to process the bank accounts etc.. So i decide to have Estonian company then when its time to Migrate will open a branch their and migrate and become as self employed cheap country, nice weather, and good ranked passport .


For Cyprus i heard a lot and i know people living there for cheaper than here in Dubai but again i feel its small and i need to have more natural views, i am fedup with sand for last 27y omg hhhh so good i have people suggest Bulgaria

But just to be honest i have a Bulgarian friend and she tell me straight forward the lawyers and accountant will eat you and rip your money if you don't know anything about the country and don't know the language so id you have someone you can trust that can help you will be much easier

Last time i calculate it with my friend its about 3k for first month to startup the things and make it lunch and next month will be just for living cost which is cheap, btw this price including the migration process and getting the card etc... From what i saw cheapest company setup in Bulgaria while you are outside is around 1.5k or 1.7k which then you need to add Bulgarian to make bank account and again rise to 2.5k =/ so again its much higher than other price, and if u was there lawyers can even double or triple that.

Looks like you've made op your mind

 

[WoWNull]

Looks like you've made op your mind

, ya if you have a better option for company setup and migration will be appreciated

 

[OTR365]

That's a hell of a conclusion WOW

I do realize my cynicism is off the charts.

I am touring the Canaries, right now in Santa Cruz de La Palma. This is a very pleasant city with many beautiful buildings, cozy squares, cafes etc. Great lifestyle, unbeatable climate year-around. This and other cities in the Canaries are anything but shitholes ...until you start paying Spanish taxes, including the wealth tax. That, and some minor inconveniences*), and it all turns into cagada.

So, I am in a s-hole of my own making: I like some places, but would not want to pay their taxes. There are some low tax countries (BG, RO, CY, GE...), where I would not like to live in. Then there are some out-of-reach options, such as Switzerland, Monaco etc. Thus far I've been too stingy to pay for an offshore solution that might become unnecessary in few years. The fees would anyway eat much of the savings.

Whenever I have a dark night of the soul, I consider capitulating: Minimizing capital gains, just holding gold and bitcoin and living off savings in a place like Spain or Portugal. Even then they would hit me with an exit tax. I am done with Asia, so that is not an option.

*) minor inconveniences = a few days ago in Las Palmas, I bought local prosciutto-styled sausage, that had a mild aftertaste of s**t. Apparently their production process has some room for improvement. Would not happen in France or Germany. There are always snakes in a paradise.

 

[GrumpyMess]

So, I am in a s-hole of my own making: I like some places, but would not want to pay their taxes. There are some low tax countries (BG, RO, CY, GE...), where I would not like to live in. Then there are some out-of-reach options, such as Switzerland, Monaco etc. Thus far I've been too stingy to pay for an offshore solution that might become unnecessary in few years. The fees would anyway eat much of the savings.

Much worse than just paying taxes is paying taxes and getting nothing in return. I am in the same situation, but I came to a conclusion that money doesn't matter when you love the country where you live. And it's not just about taxes, it is also about banks, bureaucracy, safety, language, social circle. That's why UAE, Cyprus, Georgia and other popular countries suck in the long term. A huge disadvantage is that you can't simply change the residence, it's a full of s**t process.

Consider Romania doing a setup under the micro enterprise regime

Romania is definitely a better option to Bulgaria, taxes are lower but quality of life is higher. However they have an exit tax and they disclose company's income to general public. Combining it with a beneficiary disclosure under 5AML is a total privacy disaster.

 

[Mr Magoo]

Romania is definitely a better option to Bulgaria, taxes are lower but quality of life is higher. However they have an exit tax and they disclose company's income to general public. Combining it with a beneficiary disclosure under 5AML is a total privacy disaster

what if I am not resident in RO or EU and have my company in RO. I can just take out dividends every quarter at 5%.