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BOI reporting for US LLCs (at least) temporarily suspended

#23
Forester said:
An interesting reading has arrived to my mailbox: https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/h...ends-enforcement-fincen-reporting-requirement.
In short, a TX court judgement forced FINCEN to publish an alert sounding “In light of a recent federal court order, reporting companies are not currently required to file beneficial ownership information with FinCEN and are not subject to liability if they fail to do so while the order remains in force. However, reporting companies may continue to voluntarily submit beneficial ownership information reports“ (https://fincen.gov/boi – the Alert: Impact of Ongoing Litigation – Deadline Stay – Voluntary Submission Only).
:) :) :)

The corresponding judgement (a preliminary injunction, to be exact) can be reached here https://www.nfib.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/12/TX-Top-Cop-Shop-Amended-Opinion-12-05-2024.pdf.

(It all happened almost a week ago; yet as I do not have a US LLC currently, I am not following this too closely. But I have not noticed it discussed here.)
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Any legal system should have some predictability, even precedent based one such as in US. This matter is becoming true rolercoster

https://www.gibsondunn.com/cta-upda...ership-information-reporting-may-soon-resume/
 
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#24
#26
Alexmorgan said:
Its suspended but i already applied it

As long im not going public and its within the US government only im fine
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Until they decide they don't like you anymore. By giving them your identity, they can kick your door down in the middle of the night and take you away from your children without warning. Relying on current laws is a very risky, very short sighted strategy.
 
#27
The support for CTA and BOIR existed in the previous Trump presidential administration and had bipartisan support.
It probably won't be amended towards privileged treatment of small businesses as they are the reason - money laundering thru shell companies - why CTA was introduced at the first place.
This is interesting for read

https://www.wsj.com/articles/republ...o-repeal-corporate-transparency-act-3f35498d?

https://www.wsj.com/opinion/dont-be...arent-cta-finance-873cbe73?mod=article_inline

but the proposed bill probably won't change anything.
 
#30
cherry said:
Until they decide they don't like you anymore. By giving them your identity, they can kick your door down in the middle of the night and take you away from your children without warning. Relying on current laws is a very risky, very short sighted strategy.
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The US government already knows who you are (or can easily find out) and, US person or not, will make your life difficult if they decide to do so. Debanking, unofficial blacklisting, freezing assets, sanction lists, extradition, rendition, and even drone strikes are all options on the continuum. This is a nation that forced down the President of Ecuador’s airplane because they merely suspected Edward Snowden was on board. You do have to get their attention, either specifically or administratively, though. They aren’t generally going to mess with you unless you catch their attention. The options on the more extreme side of the continuum tend to require specific as opposed to administrative attention. To use a popular saying, the US government generally can’t find its own a*****e with both hands, but if it really wants to, can and will keep adding additional hands until it finds AN a*****e. I know a venture capitalist who ran afoul of the US government for his daughter’s political views and got hit with the first three on that list.

This change increases the risk of administrative attention. It’s annoying but not really game changing.

I‘ve been watching this. I tend to drag my feet until the last second on complying with new regulations like this because they are often suspended or overturned due to legal action. It’s a quirk of the US economy.
 
#31
HardRJones said:
The US government already knows who you are (or can easily find out) and, US person or not, will make your life difficult if they decide to do so. Debanking, unofficial blacklisting, freezing assets, sanction lists, extradition, rendition, and even drone strikes are all options on the continuum. This is a nation that forced down the President of Ecuador’s airplane because they merely suspected Edward Snowden was on board. You do have to get their attention, either specifically or administratively, though. They aren’t generally going to mess with you unless you catch their attention. The options on the more extreme side of the continuum tend to require specific as opposed to administrative attention. To use a popular saying, the US government generally can’t find its own a*****e with both hands, but if it really wants to, can and will keep adding additional hands until it finds AN a*****e. I know a venture capitalist who ran afoul of the US government for his daughter’s political views and got hit with the first three on that list.

This change increases the risk of administrative attention. It’s annoying but not really game changing.

I‘ve been watching this. I tend to drag my feet until the last second on complying with new regulations like this because they are often suspended or overturned due to legal action. It’s a quirk of the US economy.
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Not necessarily. It took them 10 years to finally find Bin Laden with all their resources thrown at it. Unless you've been leaving trails on your legal identity like relying on current BOI laws (stupid), then when the US bear is chasing us all, you don't need to outrun the bear, you just need to outrun the others. So you shouldn't rely on today's US BOI laws for that reason.
 
#32
cherry said:
Not necessarily. It took them 10 years to finally find Bin Laden with all their resources thrown at it. Unless you've been leaving trails on your legal identity like relying on current BOI laws (stupid), then when the US bear is chasing us all, you don't need to outrun the bear, you just need to outrun the others. So you shouldn't rely on today's US BOI laws for that reason.
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Remind me of how that ended for Mr. bin Laden? Correct, one needs to keep a low profile to avoid sticking out too far from the crowd and avoid the administrative attention, but when the bear is chasing you specifically, there is nowhere to hide for long.

Most of us are not going to be chased specifically. We’re just not that important. We do have to worry about getting caught in the impersonal administrative nets being cast about. You can take steps to minimize that in how you structure things or even by avoiding the US entirely. It becomes considerably more difficult if one is a US person or must do business here. Compliance to US law is necessary if you wish to do business in the US, especially as a US person, and noncompliant paperwork is about the fastest way to get that administrative attention here. At the point you’ve attracted the attention, it’s already too late. The machine will, at best, grind impersonally down any legal trails that exist (and some always exist) and make your life harder until you resolve whatever attracted the attention, which will invariably involve, at a minimum, billable hours to an attorney.
 
#33
The Bin Laden story tells us that if you are the world's most wanted criminal, it would still take the US 10 years and billions of dedicated dollars to finally find you. If you are normal and operate with a low profile, the US doesn't need to know who you are or be able to track you down. One of the ways this is achieved is to interface with officialdom as little as possible. You can comply with the law by not registering an LLC and taking part in the BOI rules. Find alternatives. The point was that AlexMorgan said "As long im not going public and its within the US government only im fine (to give them his details)", to which I made the point that this is unless they decide they don't like you anymore and kick your door down for being "wrong" in some way. The best protection from the law is to not interact with them, at least not with your legal identity.
 
#34
cherry said:
The Bin Laden story tells us that if you are the world's most wanted criminal, it would still take the US 10 years and billions of dedicated dollars to finally find you. If you are normal and operate with a low profile, the US doesn't need to know who you are or be able to track you down. One of the ways this is achieved is to interface with officialdom as little as possible. You can comply with the law by not registering an LLC and taking part in the BOI rules. Find alternatives. The point was that AlexMorgan said "As long im not going public and its within the US government only im fine (to give them his details)", to which I made the point that this is unless they decide they don't like you anymore and kick your door down for being "wrong" in some way. The best protection from the law is to not interact with them, at least not with your legal identity.
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That works well until the US government decides it wants to interact with you. Then, you’re going to be interacted with regardless of your wishes. Where money flows, it can be tracked. Don’t overestimate the amount of privacy you think you have. Certainly, you can reduce the likelihood of interaction by reducing your exposure to the US economy. Looking normal reduces risk as well. So does living in a cardboard box under a highway bridge and having no bank account. Everyone has different exposures and risk profiles. You’re a US person? You’re a foreign person holding through exempt entities? Yours is a simple tax situation? Your main concern is putting assets beyond the reach of divorce lawyers? It might be acceptable or even irrelevant in some situations, and lower risk to comply than to use some alternative method.
 
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#35
HardRJones said:
That works well until the US government decides it wants to interact with you. Then, you’re going to be interacted with regardless of your wishes. Where money flows, it can be tracked. Don’t overestimate the amount of privacy you think you have. Certainly, you can reduce the likelihood of interaction by reducing your exposure to the US economy. Looking normal reduces risk as well. So does living in a cardboard box under a highway bridge and having no bank account. Everyone has different exposures and risk profiles. You’re a US person? You’re a foreign person holding through exempt entities? Yours is a simple tax situation? Your main concern is putting assets beyond the reach of divorce lawyers? It might be acceptable or even irrelevant in some situations, and lower risk to comply than to use some alternative method.
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That's why a very important part of your OPSEC is making sure the US or any other government does not decide it wants to interact with you. It's not easy being boring and there are sacrifices involved, but the US has much lower hanging fruits to grab, such as those putting their names on LLC BOIs. They wouldn't demand these BOI records if they could just find you anyway. Laws like this speak very loudly as to the strategic situation.

The gravest threat to privacy today (and money as a consequence) is facial recognition. Actually keeping a private money flow is a far simpler problem than your face becoming an ID card when any camera in the world (could even be your own phone) detects you and reports back to base. The less money tied to your identity, the less interest you will arouse. As long as LLC BOI is the way it is, it's safest not to put your name to it.
 
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#36
cherry said:
That's why a very important part of your OPSEC is making sure the US or any other government does not decide it wants to interact with you. It's not easy being boring and there are sacrifices involved, but the US has much lower hanging fruits to grab, such as those putting their names on LLC BOIs. They wouldn't demand these BOI records if they could just find you anyway. Laws like this speak very loudly as to the strategic situation.

The gravest threat to privacy today (and money as a consequence) is facial recognition. Actually keeping a private money flow is a far simpler problem than your face becoming an ID card when any camera in the world (could even be your own phone) detects you and reports back to base. The less money tied to your identity, the less interest you will arouse. As long as LLC BOI is the way it is, it's safest not to put your name to it.
Click to expand...
Clearview AI is horrifying, more so than most realize. To keep this on topic, that might be a separate thread.

Filing a BOI report with FinCen won’t necessarily make you any lower hanging fruit than you already are. Thousands upon thousands of these are filed. It’s not going to cause anyone to stand out and might not even be the first, second, or tenth thing they find when they start investigating. Sure, they’ll get around to looking there eventually. Sure, it could be the trigger. Generally, if you get swept into FtM they are going to pull on the threads where you popped up on their radar first. If your crypto wallet alternative (or anything else) happens to be flagged for any random reason, movements around that will be the very first things they investigate. The impact of this BOI filing is very situationally dependent. It could be the one thing that increases your risk the most. It could be completely irrelevant. It’s important to do the thing that attracts the least amount of attention in any case.
 
#37
marioIT said:
ALERT [updated Feb. 19, 2025]: Beneficial ownership reporting requirements are back in effect, with a new deadline of March 21, 2025 for most companies. FinCEN will assess its options for further modifying deadlines. For more info, see notice .
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of course it will be back, the USA need money and anonymity is not giving what they want.
 
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