Withdraw money on atm vs withdraw to bank account ?

[amateur]

Hi, I am new and this is my first post.

I am in affiliate industry for many years, and have small question that intrigues me for years

I am receiving payments mostly to payment systems like Payoneer and similar, have their cards and withdraw money on atm.

On the other side some inomes i can get only via wire transfer to local bank. When I receive wire, I know that on that money I need to pay tax.

Question is, what happens with money that I withdraw on atm, what is a system of tracking and so on....? Inever had any problem but I am jyst courious how that functionig?

For example, Inam living in country A, working for affiliate network that is in country B, and they pay me using Payoneer which is in country C , question is:

1 when I withdraw my earnings i n my country A, my coutry, I mean on taxes, can know that
2 when I withdraw my earnings in country D (I am on vacation, so I withdraw some money i forgen country) can my goverment know that, and then I need to pay taxes?

Hope I explained what I am asking, simply how global Master and Visa system works with local and worldwide atms and how l9cal tax services can or can 't know how much money I am earning and how much they will ask me to pay taxes.

 

[anotherone]

You payoneer card is linked to your payoneer account. Payoneer is an electronic money institution which does not need to report in compliance with CRS/AEOI. So, when you withdraw money with your payoneer card, only payoneer is aware of it. Then, if you transfer money from payoneer to a real bank in country A. the gov agency inyour country are able to access your account. You solely pay tax on the money that you transfer to your real bank in country A. If you open a bank account in a real bank in country B. you should pay tax upon A+B. I hope you get me.

 

[amateur]

Anotherone, thanks for explination.

Another question, if you know, or somebady else, when I use some/any bank atm to withdraw money, do they , I mean on the bank which atm machine I am using have my data, name, amount that I withdraw?

 

[amateur]

To be more precise, when I withdraw on any atm, does bank thatvis owner of that atm have access to some data about me, or for them there is just card number and amount?

 

[nomad999]

if the atm withdrawal is done through VISA or Mastercard network they will know.

 

[anotherone]

if the atm withdrawal is done through VISA or Mastercard network they will know.

I respect your opinion but can you provide a reference to prove this statement? For example, a link to an police investigation that was published in a newspaper, a terms of service mentionning this...etc...etc.

If payoneer asks people to report their tax, this means they don't report to the tax authorities.

 

[nomad999]

sorry i have nothing lol
this is just common sense, these payment networks are allowed everywhere because they fully comply with governments.
if your name appears on these payment network records and a government is looking for you, they most likely will get access to it, its just a matter of time at best.
Obviously I could be wrong, but in these days and age I would be very surprise if these enormous financial institutions provide us with any form of privacy from governments.

That said, in regards to automatic exchange of information, I don't thinks it's that simple so maybe someone else can shed some light. most likely it will be dependent on the country your card is aissued.

I am not talking about payoneer here but specifically visa and mastercard which your payoneer debit card is powered with.

 

[KJK]

That said, in regards to automatic exchange of information, I don't thinks it's that simple so maybe someone else can shed some light. most likely it will be dependent on the country your card is aissued.

AEOI is law that applies to bank accounts and the data is shared from banks to regulators/governments and then between governments.

If you use a card to withdraw at an ATM, the ATM operator doesn't see your personal data; the operator knows the card number, the operation requested, amount withdrawn and whether the transaction was approved (e.g. with PIN).

Some information can be retrieved from the card number (type of card, card issuer, country...) but it is not immediately tied to your person. Of course with appropriate subpoena or request, identity of the card owner can be revealed.

 

[amateur]

Kjk, thanks, this make sense, I mean this how you described is how stuffs work.

 

[nomad999]

AEOI is law that applies to bank accounts and the data is shared from banks to regulators/governments and then between governments.

If you use a card to withdraw at an ATM, the ATM operator doesn't see your personal data; the operator knows the card number, the operation requested, amount withdrawn and whether the transaction was approved (e.g. with PIN).

Some information can be retrieved from the card number (type of card, card issuer, country...) but it is not immediately tied to your person. Of course with appropriate subpoena or request, identity of the card owner can be revealed.

very interesting, thanks !
what about the information of the transactions stored at VISA/Mastercard ? any clue ?

 

[JohnLocke]

If you use a card to withdraw at an ATM, the ATM operator doesn't see your personal data; the operator knows the card number, the operation requested, amount withdrawn and whether the transaction was approved (e.g. with PIN).

Well, well until thel ast day I was believing this too. But when I swiped my Visa card through the shops card mashine I saw my name quickly show up in the display so the days where they only read your card number are over.

I'm not aware of why this don't happen in all shops but it is the second time I noticed this!

 

[KJK]

Well you're right. though I didn't write the merchant cannot see your name if they really want to. They don't see your personal details that the bank knows. As name they see data that card issuer put it as "name": ISO/IEC 7813 - Wikipedia

For Payoneer I'd say this will be your name and it cannot be changed...
I have experience with two banks which offered me to put up anything as a name; if the card is for a company account, then company name would be used.

Hopefully OP has a common name like John Smith or James Johnson Or use a company account for the Payoneer card etc.

 

[anotherone]

Well you're right. though I didn't write the merchant cannot see your name if they really want to. They don't see your personal details that the bank knows. As name they see data that card issuer put it as "name": ISO/IEC 7813 - Wikipedia

For Payoneer I'd say this will be your name and it cannot be changed...
I have experience with two banks which offered me to put up anything as a name; if the card is for a company account, then company name would be used.

Hopefully OP has a common name like John Smith or James Johnson Or use a company account for the Payoneer card etc.

@KJK I made a SEPA transfer to N26 once using N26 as recipient name rather than my name. N26 rejected the bank transfer. They told me the recipient must be my name.
With payoneer, it is the opposite.

I did a SEPA bank transfer from Paxum to payoneer using my name as recipient. Payoneer refused the transfer saying that I could not pay myself.

Conclusion:
It is a crazy world and They are insane.

 

[JohnLocke]

Don't we speak about card transactions here? I don't believe it was about wire transfers neither IBAN nor SWIFT transfers!

Question is, what happens with money that I withdraw on atm, what is a system of tracking and so on....? Inever had any problem but I am jyst courious how that functionig?

 

[ikan]

Further to original thread and very first question.

What about if : within EU states, I use ATM in country B - next door to my tax country A - using my Veritas prepaid car from country C or debit card from off shore country Z. Is it that easy for tax man to track and find datas if he's in search mode ? Rega

 

[amateur]

Further to original thread and very first question.

What about if : within EU states, I use ATM in country B - next door to my tax country A - using my Veritas prepaid car from country C or debit card from off shore country Z. Is it that easy for tax man to track and find datas if he's in search mode ? Rega

Well, this is interesting, I am also interested to hear opinions about this "scenario"?

 

[exprtadvisrdev]

Further to original thread and very first question.

What about if : within EU states, I use ATM in country B - next door to my tax country A - using my Veritas prepaid car from country C or debit card from off shore country Z. Is it that easy for tax man to track and find datas if he's in search mode ? Rega

I think that if the tax man is in search mode... they will find you no matter what you do, maybe it will take time but if they are already looking then it's because it's worth looking.

 

[1nomad]

if the tax man is in search mode... - it's too late. You have to fly under the radar. Don't use an offshore card in your country. you're really easy target if you use e.g. Payoneer card in a local supermarket

 

[Sulphur1976]

Can it really be a risk in example to pay at the petrol station of my home country with a credit card from a Belize, Georgia etc credit card?

 

[Gediminas]

Can it really be a risk in example to pay at the petrol station of my home country with a credit card from a Belize, Georgia etc credit card?

In most cases, I don't see any risk with that.