Personal account Reliable EMI for big amount

[lans]

Hi ,

I am looking for an EMI that allows me to transfer big amounts at once , am talking minimum 10k euros .
I have tried Revolut , Wise and Paysend and all have been closed after 2 or 3 transactions each .

Even after providing the right documents , it still doesn’t matter to them they still close them .
Can anyone recommend something more reliable ?

 

[Mike Forman]

Hi ,

I am looking for an EMI that allows me to transfer big amounts at once , am talking minimum 10k euros .
I have tried Revolut , Wise and Paysend and all have been closed after 2 or 3 transactions each .

Even after providing the right documents , it still doesn’t matter to them they still close them .
Can anyone recommend something more reliable ?

I cannot recommend any and believe all will be the same.

Transferring amounts over 10k eur from a personal account will trigger on every EMI KYC, also even from regular banks.

You are burning your options like this.

The best approach is to use multiple EMI and transfer smaller amounts with some decent time between them. Also need to give the account some time and build a relationship with the EMI, meaning to start with small transfers like 1000 EUR and after 6 months or so can transfer larger amounts. Still it foren make sense to transfer at once over 10k EUR, it is much better to transfer 18k eur in two times so you remain under the 10k reporting threshold.

10k EUR plus banks are required to report this to the authorities and EMIs are more risk averse for such a transfers from personal accounts (unless you are a client for longer time and have been through KYC before with regular transfers)

Others on this forum might have different advice but with any bank I believe you have to grow the account and once you are a client for several years without issues even transfers of several 100k eur would be no problem, although this is never recommended with an EMI (for personal accounts, corporate is ok)

 

[lans]

I cannot recommend any and believe all will be the same.

Transferring amounts over 10k eur from a personal account will trigger on every EMI KYC, also even from regular banks.

You are burning your options like this.

The best approach is to use multiple EMI and transfer smaller amounts with some decent time between them. Also need to give the account some time and build a relationship with the EMI, meaning to start with small transfers like 1000 EUR and after 6 months or so can transfer larger amounts. Still it foren make sense to transfer at once over 10k EUR, it is much better to transfer 18k eur in two times so you remain under the 10k reporting threshold.

10k EUR plus banks are required to report this to the authorities and EMIs are more risk averse for such a transfers from personal accounts (unless you are a client for longer time and have been through KYC before with regular transfers)

Others on this forum might have different advice but with any bank I believe you have to grow the account and once you are a client for several years without issues even transfers of several 100k eur would be no problem, although this is never recommended with an EMI (for personal accounts, corporate is ok)

Thanks for your input , I will try this method of sending under the 10k threshold into different 2 separate EMIs since that seems to be the best way out for personal account.

 

[Sols]

No problems moving large sums of money with Wise and Revolut (on personal accounts), so long as the account activities are within their acceptable use policy and can provide supporting documents and answer questions that may arise.

Still it foren make sense to transfer at once over 10k EUR, it is much better to transfer 18k eur in two times so you remain under the 10k reporting threshold.

I have seen first hand how banks and EMIs configure their monitoring systems. Nowadays, they all have the ability to set rules that capture accumulated payments in a specific timeframe. 9,000 x 2 is just as easy to catch as 18,000 x 1. Some systems are really honed in on this form of delayed accumulation, looking at multiple timeframe/amount permutations.

Based on the monitoring systems I've seen, splitting transactions is considered worse than one big transaction. Splitting is associated with attempts of concealing.

 

[AndyAresa]

Based on the monitoring systems I've seen, splitting transactions is considered worse than one big transaction. Splitting is associated with attempts of concealing.

when making crossborder payments, there is a risk that a correspondent bank stops the payment saying that compliance department must check the transaction against various sanctions list. and then such bank can keep the funds for months. the payer has no way to speed this up. so splitting payments may be not about concealing, but about mitigating such situations when large funds sent as one payment are blocked for long time.

 

[Sols]

when making crossborder payments, there is a risk that a correspondent bank stops the payment saying that compliance department must check the transaction against various sanctions list. and then such bank can keep the funds for months. the payer has no way to speed this up. so splitting payments may be not about concealing, but about mitigating such situations when large funds sent as one payment are blocked for long time.

There are legitimate reasons for splitting transactions. But nine times out of ten, it's someone trying to get around some threshold they've heard about.

The correspondent banks have access to the same monitoring systems with the same possible rules. Long ago, correspondent banks weren't really required to do much checking on what happened on correspondent accounts. But nowadays they do. So it's wise to assume that they, too, will catch 2 x 9,000 transaction from the same sender and/or to the same beneficiary.

 

[Mike Forman]

There are legitimate reasons for splitting transactions. But nine times out of ten, it's someone trying to get around some threshold they've heard about.

The correspondent banks have access to the same monitoring systems with the same possible rules. Long ago, correspondent banks weren't really required to do much checking on what happened on correspondent accounts. But nowadays they do. So it's wise to assume that they, too, will catch 2 x 9,000 transaction from the same sender and/or to the same beneficiary.

There is no clear answer on this as multiple factors might trigger a check or put the account at risk. One can have an account and transfer 500k usd without questions asked and someone else for two payments of 3k eur questions can be asked.

Frequent regular payments of 9k eur in the first six months of a new account will ofcourse also increase the risk. Just take it slowly and do a few irregular payments with smaller amounts in the first six months.

Personally on new EMI accounts I have limited myself to transfers below 10k eur and let the account age while doing infrequent but regular transfers of different amounts. After 6 months and when the EMI had asked one time questions about a transfer they mostly leave you alone. For all EMI we have had at least once questions asked in the first 6 months.

In most countries banks are required to report a transaction above 10k according local AML rules. Some EMI limit the max amount per transfer to some countries specifically for this reason. We transfer frequently to SEA and the max amount per transfer (converted) is around 9k usd for exactly this reason (above 9k AML reporting and questions are triggered). Multiple transfers of 9k usd, even on the same day do not pose any problem. This is for this specific country, other countries we can transfer freely few hundred thousand eur at a time.

To avoid questions use multiple accounts (the more the better) and transfer first small amounts irregularly while building a "relationship" with the EMI. Let the accounts age for 6-12 months and you will have a lower risk profile, hence can transfer larger amounts without questions asked.
Using +5 accounts and transfer biweekly 9k eur allows to transfer almost 100k a month.

If no urgency to transfer the money this is the method we personally use to transfer to some countries. If a larger amount needs to be transfered it's best to have some information at hand providing the reason and source. Mostly if the money already came from another account on your personal name this is sufficient as banks will assume the bank you wired from had already verified the funds.


All depends on your risk profile, your transaction history, your duration of the account and the country you wire from/to. Everyone has different experiences and I believe most with positive experiences transferring larger amount have already an EMI account for over a year and therefor a low risk profile.

Perhaps someone can confirm that they have transfered multiple large amounts withing the first weeks they had opened a new EMI without issues or questions asked. We never took this risk and use above mentioned method.