Crypto high 6 fig with no source of funds no tax returns looking to offramp

[MrTambourineBTC]

Hello!

I have high 650k in crypto looking to eventually offramp to bank and more traditional investments. Eventually but a house in Spain.

My initial source of funds came from recieving payments in crypto from poker winnings (prof poker player for 15 years) from 2017-2020. No receipts. Played on Chinese apps and the guy paid me on Sundays via BTC and later on usdt.

That was just a few k, my portfolio was 30k at the end of 2020 and made up to 650k in these 4 years in crypto (trading, farming, airdrops, all over defi...).

I never paid taxes on the money, not on my poker days, not on crypto days.

I want to start paying in 2025 and eventually be able to legalize my money and move to tradfi, buy a house etc.

I only consider Spain and Portugal.

I have 50k of legal, banked money.

What would you suggest I do?

I don't have rush, can be patient to start generating tax reports, etc. And eventually be able to comply more with banks to be able to offramp. I could see myself being low-mid 7 fig in a few years.

I'm trying to decide my strat for the next few years, so I'm all open for advice and suggestions.

Thank you very much!

 

[toums]

You cannot choose worse than Spain in that situation..

 

[NewHorizonsParaguay]

What is your citizenship?

 

[MrTambourineBTC]

You cannot choose worse than Spain in that situation..

Yes it's not ideal. I'm 50/50 for now between Spain and Portugal.

What is your citizenship?

Spanish. Sadly my life circumstances are what they are, wish I could flee to Panama or Dubai.

 

[MrTambourineBTC]

Perhaps I wasn't stressing enough my main concern is being able to eventually offramp. (Portuguese tax man is not a concern plus some tax benefits for crypto. Spanish if you start to file tax slowly on the A money shouldn't be a big concern if I don't do anything stupid. I could potentially go somewhere else in a 3-4 years.)

I was thinking of depositing my 50k of taxed money in binance/kraken and from there for a few years build credible tax reports with legit source of funds while growing the portfolio agai,

And hopefully/eventually find a legit way to add to my A portfolio funds from the other portfolio in a sensible manner. That's just the option that makes the most sense for now but I'm sure I'm missing many other good possibilities.

 

[NewHorizonsParaguay]

1. If you are willing to pay PIT on the money, you can find someone you can invoice (send him crypto), and he will pay you in fiat.

2. Find countries Spain has DTA with + buying real estate in crypto without questions is possible (the one I know is Py, but probably Dubai, and guys here will tell you more Georgia?). Add a layer by not having real estate in your name but in the company you created in the respective country. Have residency in the country (so in the company info is not your Spanish address). Rental income stream to ES and pay dividends tax (reduced under DTA). Buy smaller units (ideally, start with something worth 50k, which you have legal) - The company layer should help here a little; in the case, Hacienda would do a deep dive and ask how you created such a prosperous business. Starting a company and instantly having assets worth 600k would look bad.

//Edit. Of course, at some point sell the units, and dividends pay yourself to ES and pay dividends tax.

Most likely, some other guys will give you better solutions.

 

[JohnnyDoe]

wish I could flee to Panama or Dubai.

Why you can’t?

 

[daniels27]

Why you can’t?

His cats would run back to Spain to his mother's cat farm.

 

[MrTambourineBTC]

1. If you are willing to pay PIT on the money, you can find someone you can invoice (send him crypto), and he will pay you in fiat.

2. Find countries Spain has DTA with + buying real estate in crypto without questions is possible (the one I know is Py, but probably Dubai, and guys here will tell you more Georgia?). Add a layer by not having real estate in your name but in the company you created in the respective country. Have residency in the country (so in the company info is not your Spanish address). Rental income stream to ES and pay dividends tax (reduced under DTA). Buy smaller units (ideally, start with something worth 50k, which you have legal) - The company layer should help here a little; in the case, Hacienda would do a deep dive and ask how you created such a prosperous business. Starting a company and instantly having assets worth 600k would look bad.

//Edit. Of course, at some point sell the units, and dividends pay yourself to ES and pay dividends tax.

Most likely, some other guys will give you better solutions.

I think the first option is relatively straightforward and comes with some added advantages especially in Portugal.

I was thinking something along those lines:

Buy crypto with the 50k in a legit way. Trade, operate in defi...and make it grow. Allegedly, crypto trading activities only get taxed on 15% of your profit (heard from 2 different sources, but would need to confirm). That's max 7.5% tax. Would need to be self employed and pay more taxes or public health care I suppose.

In the meantime, something like you propose, I was thinking of paying myself a salary with crypto. Nothing too big, 2k a month let's say. Would need to find a way to obfuscate somehow or make it credible so that's my job. Pay tax on it. Keep adding it all to my legal crypto portfolio.

Then at some point, let's say when I have grown those 50k plus salaries for 2-3 years to hopefully 500k+, can leave in BTC if at cheap prices or stablecoins for a year without touching it and get it all tax free.

It would make sense, be perfectly legal (except the fake job haha) and woulve created a credible legal source of funds for the banks.

Of course legislation can change in those years, and Portugal has some exit tax, so there is some risk,gotta make sure the 0% for long term holding will be kept (Germany has it also, can't see why they can't keep it).


Could do the same from Spain, but I like the spanish tax man much less (the Portuguese tax man doesn't know/doesn't care really lol and even if you screw up, they don't turn your life into a nightmare).

 

[MrTambourineBTC]

1. If you are willing to pay PIT on the money, you can find someone you can invoice (send him crypto), and he will pay you in fiat.

2. Find countries Spain has DTA with + buying real estate in crypto without questions is possible (the one I know is Py, but probably Dubai, and guys here will tell you more Georgia?). Add a layer by not having real estate in your name but in the company you created in the respective country. Have residency in the country (so in the company info is not your Spanish address). Rental income stream to ES and pay dividends tax (reduced under DTA). Buy smaller units (ideally, start with something worth 50k, which you have legal) - The company layer should help here a little; in the case, Hacienda would do a deep dive and ask how you created such a prosperous business. Starting a company and instantly having assets worth 600k would look bad.

//Edit. Of course, at some point sell the units, and dividends pay yourself to ES and pay dividends tax.

Most likely, some other guys will give you better solutions.

In the second option, yeah the problem like you mention is all over Europe is very difficult to buy RE with crypto, you need to go through banks...

Other possibility for Spain would be to sell my house, and with the money buy a nice beachfront land and build my own house paid with cash. In Spain it's very typical to pay construction workers/materials with cash and it's relatively easy and safe to get cash for crypto if you have good contacts.

 

[daniels27]

Buy a used car, sell it in cash and add some more.

But some cryptos with cash, sell them use the transaction record to withdraw the money from coinbase to 5 different bank accounts.

Move some money offshore to an account. Repeat. But a plot of land, build houses, sell it.